picard102
Senior Member
I see people sitting on grass all the time and it doesn't seem to cross anyones mind that some animal has probably shit or pissed there 24 hours ago.
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- Thread starter drum118
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81-717
Active Member
Aside from comfort, or lack thereof, why not?
Would you rather sit on a contaminated seat or a tagged seat?
Northern Light
Superstar
Comfort is a key concern, unapologetically.
Many face long commutes sometimes after a day of hard physical work and/or standing, and a seat, a comfy seat, is a very necessary thing.
Its also an aesthetic consideration and one about whether we convert transit here to being more like the U.S., where its seen as a service for the poor, for those with no other choice, rather than for a wide
range of people, including the broad middle class, who have a choice.
When you consider transit as an optional customer, your weighing cost, convenience, and comfort and your comparing it to driving for the most part.
Imagine Nissan trying to sell you an Altima featuring hard plastic seats. Right, not happening; because no one wants that, no one aspires to it, and it would be damaging to the brand to even consider it.
Transit needs to retain and woo more 'choice' riders. People who have a car at home and could drive.
You're not going to do that by making the service less comfortable and by making it seem like something a successful person wouldn't be caught dead using.
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Amare
Senior Member
^To add to that point, if this was Metrolinx and if they came out one day and announced they are switching to plastic seats onboard GO buses and trains, I can guarantee you there would be a mass public revolt against that to the point they would be forced to reverse course.
The vast majority of people dont want plastic seats on public transit, what they do want is for the seats to be clean. I'll maintain the issue here is the TTC's practices of seat cleaning (which was all 100% outsourced for the past ~5 years up until this year). For the TTC to come out and say that they found that customers prefer plastic seats, is pure fabricated BS.
The vast majority of people dont want plastic seats on public transit, what they do want is for the seats to be clean. I'll maintain the issue here is the TTC's practices of seat cleaning (which was all 100% outsourced for the past ~5 years up until this year). For the TTC to come out and say that they found that customers prefer plastic seats, is pure fabricated BS.
Mind_the_gap
Active Member
So we started with vinyl benches on the subway/buses, then we moved to plastic/metal seats with vinyl inserts. Then the vinyl inserts became too much so we went with padded fabric seats. Those were eliminated in favour of what we have now due to flammability. Now we want to eliminate that.
All in a matter of ~30 years.
This is seriously getting ridiculous.
So when an electric bus inevitibly catches fire, how will this added plastic fare in terms of passengers safety.
Why not go the Translink route?!
All in a matter of ~30 years.
This is seriously getting ridiculous.
So when an electric bus inevitibly catches fire, how will this added plastic fare in terms of passengers safety.
Why not go the Translink route?!
T3G
Senior Member
What do you find so ridiculous about the notion that an uncomfortable seat could make one's back sore?
Anyway to weigh in on the comfort discussion, I don't think big city transit agencies can even pretend to be comfortable until there is no reasonable possibility of sitting on a urine-soaked or bedbug ridden chair. And especially not buses, which even if they had clouds for seats would still punch your brain out over every hole in the road. The bus network does a good enough job giving off low class vibes even without plastic seats.
N. B. So do GO's double deckers. Only their older MCIs can claim to be a comfortable form of transit.
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dowlingm
Senior Member
Was there an announcement about the King Station Commerce Court subway entrance (and thus the route to both platforms) being taken out of service? The escalator at Scotia Plaza NB is back in service which means somewhat more throughput on the stairs, but I would think it’s gonna be uncomfortable during peak/crowding while this goes on. While I’m sure it’s necessary to complete the elevator project, I hope that work blocks are being maximized to get at least the concourse and one entrance open.
At least the SB has Melinda Street (exit only) but clearly whoever wrote the sign on the NB platform doesn’t know it’s only one side
At least the SB has Melinda Street (exit only) but clearly whoever wrote the sign on the NB platform doesn’t know it’s only one side
DSCToronto
Superstar
The King Station TTC project page is a mess of information and confusing photos! https://cdn.ttc.ca/-/media/Project/...---Pre-Construction-Community-Update-2025.pdf
Mihairokov
Senior Member
Supposedly the King Station NB platform escalator is in service now as well.
81-717
Active Member
Then how is fabric in any way preferable to vinyl (as far as comfort goes)? It is both harder and more absorbent, so that's a no-win.
I don't find NYC subway seats to be ugly, the R46 seats on the other hand look quite cool, nor do I find the T1/TR seats to be anything noteworthy aesthetically.
ARG1
Senior Member
To add to this, I want to point out that when I visited NYC back in 2022, I virtually never sat down on the subway unless my legs were really tired. Simply put, it was genuinely painful to sit on for longer periods of time, and I would sometimes leave the train with jelly legs because of the reduced bloodflow. Like, anything but plastic seats please.
81-717
Active Member
Northern Light
Superstar
It doesn't stick to your skin if you're sweaty/clammy/damp
Vinyl does.
Fabric can be quite soft, now, no one is advocating for suede, but there are certainly softer fabrics that can be procured.
My couch is fabric, it was treated with stain guard, I have no stains on it. Now, I don't spill on it much at all, but the odd time............
No problem, its a quick wipe with damp cloth, anything and everything comes off, including red wine.
No reason w/the right weave and treatment that you can't have a very liquid repellent fabric.
I do.
I don't like the cattlecar arrangement either. and as @ARG1 notes above, they are quite uncomfortable.
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81-717
Active Member
As opposed to absorbing your sweat? And how would it stick to your skin through your clothes (which the vast majority of riders would be wearing)?
The fabric in question (TTC) doesn't fall under that category.
The R46s have almost the exact same seating arrangement as the TTC.
Northern Light
Superstar
Answered in the post you're quoting.
Also answered, there are other fabrics, not only one in the world.
Fair point, I was reflexively thinking of the more common layout on NYC cars.