[Cambry Ardship]

Both of those links are american and the trajectory for road safety in Canada is not the same.

Here's a very recent article about the divergence in outcomes: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...ing-in-different-directions-on-traffic-safety.

 

[T3G]

^ you wouldn't realize that to be the case at all if you stand around any random intersection in Toronto for 5 minutes. If you told me they were handing out driver's licenses like a free giveaway, I would have no reason to doubt you.

 

[PurplePinky]

I’m concerned about these ‘cars’ aging and rusting out while the drivers continue to do practice runs.

This has been going on for quite some time, I’d like to think they could now be filled with passengers.

Many bus stops have been shut down and the public has been waiting far too long.

Let’s go folks, way past time to open the LRT.

 

[Northern Light]

Both of those links are american and the trajectory for road safety in Canada is not the same.

Here's a very recent article about the divergence in outcomes: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...ing-in-different-directions-on-traffic-safety.

That's a very good piece, thanks for posting.

I would offer that something I found noteworthy is that while Canada's stats are tracking favourably vs the U.S. we're still only middle-of-the-pack when comparing to a wider range of OECD countries.

So the piece really indicates, Canada is doing ok, a bit better than in the past, but its not outstanding, where the U.S. is really bottom-of-the-barrel in traffic safety.

 

[toonderly]

No as ML own the cars and want their own colours to keep them separate from other systems colours. Finch and Hurontario cars are the same colour as Eglinton.

What on earth purpose does this serve? I can understand GO branding being different from the TTC because there is a fare difference issue and it benefits the public to be aware of it. But in this scenario where the LRT is part of the TTC network and the public should be able to treat it as such it feels like marking it as different can only lead to confusion.

 

[kev1n1m]

No as ML own the cars and want their own colours to keep them separate from other systems colours. Finch and Hurontario cars are the same colour as Eglinton.

Not sure where you heard this, but you generally know everything drum. I read (from Metrolinx, early in the process of building Line 5) that the grey was chosen to match higher-order transit, specifically the Line 1 Toronto Rockets. This doesn't really hold the test of time (like everything Metrolinx does) because the Line 3 trains and the new Line 2 trains will all sport color to some degree, albeit not as much as the CLRV or SRT cars.

 

[zang]

Not sure where you heard this, but you generally know everything drum. I read (from Metrolinx, early in the process of building Line 5) that the grey was chosen to match higher-order transit, specifically the Line 1 Toronto Rockets. This doesn't really hold the test of time (like everything Metrolinx does) because the Line 3 trains and the new Line 2 trains will all sport color to some degree, albeit not as much as the CLRV or SRT cars.

I would have assumed the TTC stopped painting subway cars simply because it's been cash starved for decades and could save a few bucks; not for any aesthetic reason.

 

[zang]

Both of those links are american and the trajectory for road safety in Canada is not the same.

Here's a very recent article about the divergence in outcomes: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...ing-in-different-directions-on-traffic-safety.

Am I wrong, or does the data not cover Canada past 2020? Post-covid stuff has certainly changed. I don't know if it's the links to covid and brain damage, but it's so rare that I don't see terrible infractions at every single intersection I cross.

 

[fiendishlibrarian]

I would have assumed the TTC stopped painting subway cars simply because it's been cash starved for decades and could save a few bucks; not for any aesthetic reason.

They briefly tried.

 

[Cambry Ardship]

I agree there's lot of traffic safety issues still (and I encounter them almost everyday too), but for a host of reasons that doesn't seem to translate into the same trends that the americans are seeing with increasing numbers of collisions.

Here's Toronto's serious automobile collision statistics (from https://data.torontopolice.on.ca/pages/automobile). Obviously there's going to be far more minor collisions but the trendlines are moving in the right direction, if all too slowly.

To tie it back more directly to Line 5, my hope is that this means the various responsible bodies in Toronto are capable of taking measures that, at the minimum, over time, reduce number of collisions with the LRVs.

I've got to imagine increasing familiarity will play a role in safety too. When I saw them relatively close in-person for the first time, I was surprised how big the LRVs were. I was picturing in my mind sort of a larger streetcar but they are very much bigger and quicker moving.

 

[duffo]

I agree there's lot of traffic safety issues still (and I encounter them almost everyday too), but for a host of reasons that doesn't seem to translate into the same trends that the americans are seeing with increasing numbers of collisions.

Here's Toronto's serious automobile collision statistics (from https://data.torontopolice.on.ca/pages/automobile). Obviously there's going to be far more minor collisions but the trendlines are moving in the right direction, if all too slowly.

View attachment 673396

To tie it back more directly to Line 5, my hope is that this means the various responsible bodies in Toronto are capable of taking measures that, at the minimum, over time, reduce number of collisions with the LRVs.

I've got to imagine increasing familiarity will play a role in safety too. When I saw them relatively close in-person for the first time, I was surprised how big the LRVs were. I was picturing in my mind sort of a larger streetcar but they are very much bigger and quicker moving.

They are nearly the same vehicle as the TTC streetcars, both are Bombardier Flexities. The LRT just has two coupled together whereas streetcars are solo.

 

[nfitz]

Am I wrong, or does the data not cover Canada past 2020? Post-covid stuff has certainly changed. I don't know if it's the links to covid and brain damage, but it's so rare that I don't see terrible infractions at every single intersection I cross.

It was my observation, returning to a similar commute in 2023 that I left in 2009, that things were much worse. The racists blame non-white immigrants, but the folks I had verbal interactions with, they most certainly weren't in that category! Sure, failing to stop while turning on red lights and stop signs was common enough back then - but the extreme turning right across traffic from the outer lane (at speed even!) and trying to overtake people on the shoulder (and then honking the horn if someone was too far to the side) wasn't like this. Or the sense of privilege and tendency towards conflict.

That said, are diverting outcomes between Canada and the USA perhaps the difference between the numbers of people driving cars, versus pedestrian-killing SUVs and oversized farmer trucks?

 

[Admiral Beez]

Both of those links are american and the trajectory for road safety in Canada is not the same. Here's a very recent article about the divergence in outcomes: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...ing-in-different-directions-on-traffic-safety.

"Another factor could be differences in vehicle size. Although Ford’s F-Series pickup trucks were for many years the best-selling vehicle on both sides of the border, Canada’s relatively lower wealth, higher fuel costs, and denser cities may be nudging residents to purchase somewhat smaller models than their American peers."

If we would introduce a nation-wide large vehicle tax, say 25% on anything non-commercial that is heavier than 1,500 kgs. (3,500 lbs) and greater than 5m long and 2m wide (excluding mirrors) while at the same time having Transport Canada approve smaller vehicles sold overseas, we would go a long way to riding our roads of obese arses in F-150s.

 

[innsertnamehere]

"Another factor could be differences in vehicle size. Although Ford’s F-Series pickup trucks were for many years the best-selling vehicle on both sides of the border, Canada’s relatively lower wealth, higher fuel costs, and denser cities may be nudging residents to purchase somewhat smaller models than their American peers."

If we would introduce a nation-wide large vehicle tax, say 25% on anything non-commercial that is heavier than 1,500 kgs. (3,500 lbs) and greater than 5m long and 2m wide (excluding mirrors) while at the same time having Transport Canada approve smaller vehicles sold overseas, we would go a long way to riding our roads of obese arses in F-150s.

This kind of talk while popular in urbanist circles would be wildly unpopular with the wider population and ultimately doesn't address any real pressing policy issues beyond urbanists distaste of pickup trucks.

 

[Northern Light]

This kind of talk while popular in urbanist circles would be wildly unpopular with the wider population and ultimately doesn't address any real pressing policy issues beyond urbanists distaste of pickup trucks.

I wouldn't go that far.

There is certainly conjecture and perhaps empirical evidence that vehicles with taller front ends are at greater risk of accidents. The linkage, beyond any assertion of the predisposition of those who choose to buy 'x' is that it gives you reduced visibility of anything short/close, and that mean people, cyclists, but also the exact location of that small car to which you're way too close.

Limiting ownership only to businesses would seem impractical, and limiting engine power seems questionable too.

But I think a luxury tax of sorts that exempts businesses (ie. contractors) makes some sense.

I get that that the vehicle type may make sense in a more rural setting, exempting by address seems impractical though.

I'd certainly agree that anything that is a de facto ban ownership would not be well received and has real policy drawbacks. However, I think that less ownership of large vehicles by people who have no need of them makes good sense.
The only question in my mind is whether there's a policy tool that threads the needle well.