[Northern Light]

VisionZero logic believe that even one death is too many.

Therefore we must do EVERYTHING possible to reduce the speed of cars to make sure there isn't even a single death.

Which is ludicrous.

Because no matter how much you slow cars down people wills till jaywalk and cyclists will still swerve into traffic without warning.

But VisionZero doesn't care and therefore we have speedbumps on almost every side street.

We have childishly lows speed limits. 60km/h roads are 40km/h. 50km/h roads are 30km/h.

And then we have speed camera handing out tickets for as little as 9 km/h over.

So no, I can't do better. It's nuts.

And I'm merely poking fun at that by saying, what if we applied similiar logic to LRTs!

Good day sir!

I will not carry this on indefinitely.

But I will state two things clearly.

Your 'facts' are simply wrong.

And there are times you shouldn't tell a joke...

That person clinging to life is someone's son or daughter, someone's mother or father, someone's sibling or best friend or spouse.

If that person were your wife or your child .....and someone else was poking fun .....how would you feel about it? Right..

 

[toronto647]

Sadly, a serious injury this afternoon, with a pedestrian hit by a train.

View attachment 672284

This will add an extra 2-4 weeks in investigating why this happened at least by Metrolinx and TTC. More delays

 

[crs1026]

The Eglinton line has very long stretches between pedestrian crossovers. If this were a road, we would be increasing the number of crosswalks and ensuring no long stretches between them. And building refuge islands.

Vision Zero blames the road design, not the driver or the pedestrian. We have designed an LRT as if there is no need for pedestrians to cross it safely. Maybe that's the problem.

- Paul

 

[Northern Light]

The Eglinton line has very long stretches between pedestrian crossovers. If this were a road, we would be increasing the number of crosswalks and ensuring no long stretches between them. And building refuge islands.

Vision Zero blames the road design, not the driver or the pedestrian. We have designed an LRT as if there is no need for pedestrians to cross it safely. Maybe that's the problem.

- Paul

I agree w/the sentiment Paul.....

But I would point out Eglinton IS a road.

Not meaning to be silly, just saying.

***

I would also note, the nearest traffic light west of Pharmacy is only 222m away, meaning maximum walking distance to a traffic light of 111m

It is further if this was to the east of Pharmacy with a gap of ~460m, or max. walk of 230m to a light.

But as there are no intervening blocks, I'm not sure another light would be justified.

For sure, Eglinton here should have been designed better from a pedestrian and cycling point of view, and would be today. A painted bike lane does not cut it. and providing some standing space next to the tracks would make a world of sense.

Still, I would point out, Eglinton was previously 3 lanes each way, plus a turning lane in many spots. So its far safer post-LRT than it was previously. (its now 2 lanes + LRT, + left turn lanes at lights)

There is an intention to make improvements here, relatively soon. though they won't be as robust as one would like, but there is money budgeted. Some improvements will occur with redevelopment over time as well.

 

[cateran]

Assuming the LRV didn't move much afterwards, based on the image from CP24 and from using Google Street View the collision seems to have happened at the eastern edge of the intersection of Eglinton Square and Eglinton Avenue

This intersection currently has pedestrian crossings at all edges except for the eastern one
(Had to use Google Earth because Google Maps is very out of date)

Obviously we need to wait for more details to confirm but it seems possible to me that they were crossing along this edge when they were hit
The solution to me would then be to add a pedestrian crossing to this side of the intersection
I also feel in general it is silly to leave one side of an intersection without a crossing though

 

[Steve X]

Assuming the LRV didn't move much afterwards, based on the image from CP24 and from using Google Street View the collision seems to have happened at the eastern edge of the intersection of Eglington Square and Eglington Avenue
View attachment 672308View attachment 672309

This intersection currently has pedestrian crossings at all edges except for the eastern one
(Had to use Google Earth because Google Maps is very out of date)
View attachment 672310

Obviously we need to wait for more details to confirm but it seems possible to me that they were crossing along this edge when they were hit
The solution to me would then be to add a pedestrian crossing to this side of the intersection
I also feel in general it is silly to leave one side of an intersection without a crossing though

Thanks for the imagery. See there is no place to stand between the roadway and the tracks. The grass and concrete mixed ROW does add confusion.

There are fencing along some parts of the ROW where elevation differs between the tracks and roadway. They should extend that to the entire golden miles stretch where jaywalking is common.

The 30 km/h limit has been imposed on Queens Quay and parts of Spadina near Chinatown where jaywalking is common. As far as we all hate it, the TTC seems to love doing this. Hence why I mention it.

 

[thettctransitfanatic]

but it seems possible to me that they were crossing along this edge when they were hit
The solution to me would then be to add a pedestrian crossing to this side of the intersection
I also feel in general it is silly to leave one side of an intersection without a crossing though

On the CP24 coverage of the incident, they mentioned that in the time the police were there, several pedestrians appeared to be crossing across the tracks and the police had to tell them not to go near the LRV or on the tracks.

 

[Admiral Beez]

We have designed an LRT as if there is no need for pedestrians to cross it safely.

Just wait until there are thousands of residents living on either side wanting or even being encouraged to walk across Eglinton.

..several pedestrians appeared to be jaywalking across the tracks and the police had to tell them not to go near the LRV or on the tracks.

The very term is akin to victim blaming. People will cross where they want to, and the road and LRV should be designed to reasonable accommodate those who want to cross the road. It’s not realistic to expect anyone to deviate more than a few minutes from their preferred straight A to B line.

 

[T3G]

There are fencing along some parts of the ROW where elevation differs between the tracks and roadway. They should extend that to the entire golden miles stretch where jaywalking is common.

I would much rather we discouraged jaywalking by designing the infrastructure correctly, i.e. with an appropriate amount of crosswalks, and safety zones to prevent people from blindly walking forward:



Or even what they do in Kitchener-Waterloo, where there are gates and audible warning signals that sound when a train approaches. Putting up a wall would just make an already pedestrian hostile landscape more unpleasant to traverse.

 

[Towered]

I’m starting to feel like somebody somewhere has a voodoo doll of this line…

 

[thettctransitfanatic]

I’m starting to feel like somebody somewhere has a voodoo doll of this line…

Well yeah, it sure is feeling quite cursed...

 

[txlseries4]

I find it hard to blame people from crossing midblock -- especially here where for several years it's been a safe place to cross because there weren't any trains running -- when the legal options are 5+ minutes out of the way. Detours with similar time delays are rare for drivers, but common place for pedestrians, and then people shake their heads about what the person was thinking.

 

[txlseries4]

I’m starting to feel like somebody somewhere has a voodoo doll of this line…

Doug Ford conspiring for the city to take the blame for the Crosstown LRT so he can intervene and finally become Mayor:

 

[thettctransitfanatic]

I find it hard to blame people from crossing midblock -- especially here where for several years it's been a safe place to cross because there weren't any trains running -- when the legal options are 5+ minutes out of the way. Detours with similar time delays are rare for drivers, but common place for pedestrians, and then people shake their heads about what the person was thinking.

You have a good point. This incident definitely will challenge people's inherent anti pedestrian bias...

 

[Undead]

It's true that we often apply the principles of vision zero incorrectly. For example, too often the City lowers speed limits without changing the physical design of a road.

However, it's neither the time nor place to litigate that in this thread after this tragedy.