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Northern Light said:
It was 8 million at the time, inflation adjusted it would be about 11.5M today.
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Ah, I'm sorry; perhaps the $5 million was the net rather than gross. The entire fare scheme wasn't cheap to administer - even with Presto because of the % take by Metrolinx.

I'll ignore the rest - other than to say I think think you are over-reacting to a relatively mild objection. I simply feel that you are 100% wrong on this.

Nor do I think that it's just two of us. Most of council supported the right-wing proposal to make it free. It was hardly contentious, and I've never heard any contention outside of a handful of us transit geeks.
 
81-717 said:
I don't care if they get sent to Australia or wherever, it has no effect on the historical fleet's existence, even if someone else picks up the tab for the TTC.
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What in hell does this have to do with the TTC keeping (or not keeping) the historical fleet around? Every time someone mentions historic vehicles you always change the argument so that you come out of it looked like a spurned lover.

You initially made the claim that the TTC has not dismantled their heritage fleet to save money. (Let the fact that the heritage fleet constituted a trivial part of the operational costs not be any kind of factor here - we live in 2025, when anyone can make up whatever facts they want to suit their narrative). I said you can't know that unless they bring them back post-Hillcrest reconstruction. If they don't, it doesn't matter WHO takes them - the cost will no longer be picked up by the TTC.

IF the TTC takes them back and shows a commitment to keeping the historic vehicles, then I'll eat my words. Not a moment before. The moment of truth is not coming for years, and selling the removal of heritage assets as some kind of cash injection is very easy to people with no imagination and no appreciation for history. I'm not at all convinced they'll be back.
 

TTC Greenwood Shops Open House Next Saturday​


Join the TTC for a fun, family-friendly day exploring subway maintenance and infrastructure facilities at the TTC Greenwood Complex (400 Greenwood).

The evet takes place next Saturday, September 21st from 9 a.m. to 3 p.m.
Admission is $5, kids two and under are free. All proceeds go to United Way Greater Toronto.

Enjoy a variety of activities including:

  • Guided tours of Greenwood Shop
  • TTC vehicles and work cars on display
  • Virtual subway simulator
  • Face painting and kids activities
  • Charity BBQ, silent auction and memorabilia sale
This event is accessible. Bus and Wheel-Trans shuttles between Coxwell Station and the event will be available.
 
T3G said:
Something doesn't square here, the 21st is Sunday.
The correct date is September 20.

Join us at the TTC Greenwood Shop Open House!

www.ttc.ca www.ttc.ca
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Human Resources appreciates your application to work at the TTC.

Unfortunately, you were disqualified from an interview on the basis that being able to read a calendar is no longer considered acceptable.

Thank you for your interest in the TTC.
 
zang said:
Yeah, sure. Adults are following kids' example. Okay.
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Not in that sense, but in the sense of being disgruntled over having to pick up the tab (in the form of fare increases) for the freeloaders.

zang said:
So, buses are "packed" for a handful of stops with kids? Is it just roving waves of ambiguously-aged short-run teenagers packing the King Streetcar from nearly end to end? C'mon.
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Don't remember the last time I've ever been on the 504 (if ever) so I wouldn't know. But in the suburbs apparently so.

T3G said:
IF the TTC takes them back and shows a commitment to keeping the historic vehicles, then I'll eat my words. Not a moment before. The moment of truth is not coming for years
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And if & when every single T1/TR is scrapped, then I'll eat my words (about there being a conspiracy). Not a moment before. The moment of truth (T1 replacement) is not coming for years (but hopefully not any more than a few short years now).
 
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nfitz said:
More egregiously, the third of that cluster was 9 minutes early, on a route that runs every 7 minutes! Why operators like this aren't terminated I don't know.
View attachment 680224

That said, I don't see any terrible gaps until near 6 pm (an 18-minute gap caused by the preceding bus being 12-minutes early).
View attachment 680225
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That’s pretty harsh “Why operators like this aren’t terminated I don’t know”.

Did you dig into these 2 specific streetcars? Could the blame be placed on the route supervisor? Transit control? Other factors impacting the route? A short turn?

So an operator should lose their job that easily? That’s outrageous
 
Do the operators have schedule adherence data in their onboard computers? If they do, there is no excuse whatsoever for running hot, even if the route supervisor is also incompetent.
 
81-717 said:
Not in that sense, but in the sense of being disgruntled over having to pick up the tab (in the form of fare increases) for the freeloaders.
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"They made me do it" isn't an excuse either.

No one here complaining against free child fares, has yet to produce a single shred of evidence that teens masquerading as pre-teens are in any way a widespread problem or serious strain on the TTC, financially or otherwise.
 
One comment on teen/student fares: I had my kids' Presto cards on my account, and set to refill with autoload. They were not paying, so I have no reason to think they would not have tapped every time they rode the TTC. I could look up their ride history of I had wanted to.

Yes there is no requirement for autoload to be set up on a Presto card, but it was so much more convenient than being asked to refill their cards all the time. I imagine most of not all teens have their fares paid for by their parents.

Anyway, the discussion seems to have moved on from this
 
zang said:
You didn't imply adults would skip fares because they're angry they saw kids doing it? It read like that to me:
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Yes I did, but it's quite a leap to go from that to "they made me do it". Someone skipping fares because they're upset about others legally riding free implies they themselves made the conscious choice to, not that anyone else made them.
 
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