[Mihairokov]

We'll set aside for a moment the dearth of TTC (and GO) stations where one can find any coffee at all, let alone a good one..............

But just for fun............. I'll point out that you can indeed order entrees in some subway stations (around the world)

Oh, I know there are full-on restaurants in stations, but forgive me if I was imagining Warden Station with my comment and not Union Station.

 

[Northern Light]

Oh, I know there are full-on restaurants in stations, but forgive me if I was imagining Warden Station with my comment and not Union Station.

Of course...........that's why I said 'for fun'.

Though.....the link I posted is certainly not Grand Central.....

I'll extract a few pics to show the path to entry:

 

[T3G]

We'll set aside for a moment the dearth of TTC (and GO) stations where one can find any coffee at all, let alone a good one..............

But just for fun............. I'll point out that you can indeed order entrees in some subway stations (around the world)

The Michelin Star Restaurant in an NYC Subway Station

âNÅksu is located underneath the 32nd Street subway station which is unconventional for a typical fine dining restaurant.â Bon Appétit spends a day on the line with Jing Wen Ng, Chef de cuisine at NÅksu in New York City. Located in the subway, no gas stoves or open fires are allowed, so chefs...

www.bonappetit.com

View attachment 626069

Off topic, but if someone tries to go to a 32nd Street station they may find themselves disappointed.


Rather a crucial oversight for a magazine trying to promo the restaurant, I reckon.

According to Google Maps there is only one such restaurant called this and it is located in the proximity of the 34th Street - Herald Square station on the BDFM NQRW, and the 33rd Street station of the PATH.

 

[evandyk]

Also, that chart is saying that 29% of streetcar passengers evade fares, not that 29% of them pay.

On the 504, which I ride daily, it's more than 70% who pay. But I don't doubt that the figure is accurate over all the streetcar lines. There is not nearly enough visible fare enforcement.

 

[ShonTron]

You swiped your card? From my observation I'd say only about half of those on the streetcars do. Steve Munro has it at 30%.

On streetcars, it’s very tempting to pass the Presto machines without tapping if you see others on board who haven’t paid either.

I imagine most people entering the subway without paying do so through the bus driveways such as at St. George or Wellesley. It’s much more difficult (though not impossible) to avoid paying at the gates – but easy to tap with a senior or child fare.

 

[evandyk]

You only have to apply a tiny amount of social pressure to people to get them to comply. Even walking by the driver on a bus raises the tap rate compared to all-door boarding on a streetcar. And seeing other people not tap raises the license for sure.

 

[Richard White]

I imagine most people entering the subway without paying do so through the bus driveways such as at St. George or Wellesley. It’s much more difficult (though not impossible) to avoid paying at the gates – but easy to tap with a senior or child fare.

Prior to closure, this used to be a huge issue at Warden with people walking in off the streets.

High Park has it right in my opinion. You need to pay a fare or have a transfer when going between buses and subways at that station.

 

[Northern Light]

Prior to closure, this used to be a huge issue at Warden with people walking in off the streets.

High Park has it right in my opinion. You need to pay a fare or have a transfer when going between buses and subways at that station.

That's because the bus platform is outside of the Paid Area.

It would make no sense to require transfers when boarding inside a paid area.

In any event, transfers will soon be a thing of the past.

 

[Richard White]

It would make no sense to require transfers when boarding inside a paid area.

It would prevent fare evasion via the bus bays.

 

[Northern Light]

It would prevent fare evasion via the bus bays.

No it wouldn't.

Because you have all-door boarding at stations, and so people can board without showing the transfer or tapping.

To do away with all-door boarding at stations would cost tens of millions in terms of congestion and delays for buses requiring vastly more operators. It would also lengthen trips and annoy paying riders.

Fare enforcement is what's required. That means proof-of-payment. Which for now, can include a transfer, but in the future it will be Presto, your Debit/Credit/Apple Pay etc. or physical presto ticket.

 

[evandyk]

I think you are technically supposed to tap again when boarding a new vehicle within the fair paid area? I thought that was the rule, though obviously nobody does it (including me).

 

[nfitz]

I think you are technically supposed to tap again when boarding a new vehicle within the fair paid area? I thought that was the rule, though obviously nobody does it (including me).

They were saying that when tap initially started, but they seem to have come to their senses and haven't been saying that very loudly lately.

If you look at https://www.ttc.ca/Fares-and-passes/PRESTO-on-the-TTC it now says:

You must tap your card every time you enter a station and when you board a vehicle on the street, even if you have a monthly pass on your card. Your tapped PRESTO card is your Proof-of-Payment

 

[Steve X]

On the 504, which I ride daily, it's more than 70% who pay. But I don't doubt that the figure is accurate over all the streetcar lines. There is not nearly enough visible fare enforcement.

It really depends on the time of the day. Evenings and beyond is usually the time where most fare evasion happens shown by TTC reports. Those going to work are more likely going to pay than those hanging around at night.

Who knows what happened on the night cars.

 

[Admiral Beez]

You only have to apply a tiny amount of social pressure to people to get them to comply. Even walking by the driver on a bus raises the tap rate compared to all-door boarding on a streetcar. And seeing other people not tap raises the license for sure.

It definitely makes me feel the naive rube for tapping when those getting on around me do not. It's especially galling when scofflaws are impatient to get onboard behind me if I fumble while tapping.

 

[Admiral Beez]

They were saying that when tap initially started, but they seem to have come to their senses and haven't been saying that very loudly lately.

If you look at https://www.ttc.ca/Fares-and-passes/PRESTO-on-the-TTC it now says:

You must tap your card every time you enter a station and when you board a vehicle on the street, even if you have a monthly pass on your card. Your tapped PRESTO card is your Proof-of-Payment

Does tapping when transferring extend the 2 hour free return trip window? If so that would encourage more to tap.