[nfitz]

Should we ban probation then?

A quick look at data suggests there's about 8,000 in Ontario currently in jail, and 32,000 on probation.

So at a minimum we'd have to quadruple the prison budget.

I doubt this guy is getting probabation though - even if the information suggests this is domestic, suggesting he isn't a risk to the general population.

 

[zang]

Might not be a bad idea for certain types of crimes.

For violent crime, in most cases yes. There is such a thing as bad people.

Violent crimes rarely get probation. The exception is domestic assault, which I'm sure will turn out to be the case here.

I do believe that probation in DA should only be reserved for extreme cases, as that seemingly enables assaulters to reengage with their victims.

That said, we also have a justice system that's supposed to be based on rehabilitation, and recidivism rates in general have been dropping; Criminal Offences: 23%, Provincial Offences, Ontario: 37%. If we want to move towards a purely penalizing system of justice and imprisonment, buckle up for US-style recidivism rates.

All conservative media reactionary fearmongering aside; given that more than ¾ of those with criminal convictions don't reoffend within 5 years of release, and that number seems to be growing, doesn't that mean the system is working?

 

[evandyk]

This is also not the main situation where bail is important. We know the guy did the stabbing, but in many cases, being charged with a crime does not mean that you actually committed the crime. Should you rot in jail until our notoriously slow courts figure that out?

I have a friend who is a prosecutor, who tells me that the single most important thing a government could do if they want to reduce the number of people who get bail is to (a) speed up the courts so people can get trials in a timely fashion; and (b) improve the conditions in the jails so that judges view them as humane places for someone to await a trial.

 

[nfitz]

I have a friend who is a prosecutor, who tells me that the single most important thing a government could do if they want to reduce the number of people who get bail is to (a) speed up the courts so people can get trials in a timely fashion; and (b) improve the conditions in the jails so that judges view them as humane places for someone to await a trial.

All of which lands on the provincial government. Someone needs to do something about Doug Ford's catch-and-release program.

 

[evandyk]

Yup.

 

[PurplePinky]

The system has been a mess long before DF came along.

 

[PL1]

The system has been a mess long before DF came along.

Yes, but there's only so long he can blame the "McGuinty-Wynne" Liberals for any issues. He has it within his means to build more courts

 

[txlseries4]

Turning this back to the TTC, a few weeks ago I was on the subway in the morning and saw a ton of kids/teens (ages 9-14) in small groups with a camp counselor wearing a City Scouts shirt. Each of the groups were heading to a different part of the city to do a task or solve a problem/challenge. The camp describes itself as "Fostering independence through urban adventure" has an Instagram where you can see some highlights. Was really cool to see kids camps utilizing transit as a way to facilitate their programs and explore the city.

 

[evandyk]

One of my friend’s kids did that camp this year. It sounds fun! My son is too young for now.

 

[81-717]

suggesting he isn't a risk to the general population

Unless he's released again (hopefully not), a better question would be, is he a risk to the general prison population, or at risk from same

 

[turbanplanner]

Should we ban probation then?

We should have strikes or something, I get bail is a right and you're technically not guilty. But if it's like your 3rd or 4th time getting arrested (before trial) maybe it displays a pattern.....

 

[PL1]

We should have strikes or something, I get bail is a right and you're technically not guilty. But if it's like your 3rd or 4th time getting arrested (before trial) maybe it displays a pattern.....

I imagine 3 strikes laws would not be constitutional

 

[81-717]

We should have strikes or something, I get bail is a right and you're technically not guilty. But if it's like your 3rd or 4th time getting arrested (before trial) maybe it displays a pattern.....

I imagine 3 strikes laws would not be constitutional

When @turbanplanner said we should have strikes, I interpreted it as we (the general population) should go on strike until we see change, totally forgot about 3 strike laws, lol.

 

[turbanplanner]

I imagine 3 strikes laws would not be constitutional

Not specifically a strikes system but something that in between our current system that gives people basically being given unlimited bail until trail and a gestapo.

Honestly though the best solution I see is an occasional police presence at major stations. Look how many constables are at exhibition GO even outside the CNE season?

Or we can do nothing and have kids play on the tracks because there are no consequences for a stupid dare.

 

[81-717]

Cool. Meanwhile, 5707 hasn't been seen at its usual location for over a week Hopefully it's just being used for a film shoot and will be back eventually.

Went to check again today, it's back now