Monarch Butterfly
Superstar
Except during rush hours... with the exception of those who stop to get coffee, of course.
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Except during rush hours... with the exception of those who stop to get coffee, of course.
crs1026
Superstar
Yeah, it's gonna be a shock to some folks when they start enforcing no stopping outside the coffee shops;-)
The issue on Eglinton West is not the LRT per se. There will definitely be enough room for the existing 2 roadway lanes plus LRT in the center. What is changing is the form of the street and the degree of flexibility for traffic. Instead of wide, often uncurbed shoulders, the street will be urban in style.....no shoulders, sidewalks right at the curb, buildings right at the sidewalk. Any presence of work vehicles or stuck cars will mean lane closures, where at present work vehicles just pull off on the shoulder.
A lot of the residents' frustration is that when the City sold the land, they left only the bare minimum 45m where they could have left wider shoulders for a much more interesting streetscape. LRT is the last to arrive, so it gets blamed, but it was a bad plan all along. None of the good ideas that Ms Keesmaat is espousing got applied when the City evaluated the land sale. The pedestrian/bicycle friendliness factor will be very low. Even if we assume LRT will work fine, the bicycle/pedestrian factor is actually the biggest sellout in the plan. I'm not sure about right turn lanes, either.
I spoke at the public meeting and made a point of grinding the politicians on the land sale. It's a done deal, but it's important to remind our Council members that decisions of that sort come back to bite. I'm still a believer in erring on the side of grade separating LRT, especially at arterial intersections, but having the land sale result in the mix differentiates Eglinton West from the norm on that point.
- Paul
LNahid2000
Senior Member
Eglinton between Jane and Highway 427 already has some of the best bike lanes in the city. I agree with you that there may be issues in pedestrian friendliness though.
crs1026
Superstar
Yes - the bike lanes are great - the question is whether they will stay that way. The new plan will move them next to the road. The planner at the public meeting commented to that effect. What we have may be gone soon.
- Paul
LNahid2000
Senior Member
That's too bad. Moving them to the side of the road would actually decrease their attractiveness from present day.
Palma
Senior Member
we already knew it would not be heavy rail from the Metrolinx board meeting back in Feb. But i find it unlikely it was be bus. The whole point is to connect the eat to the west along that corridor and then to airport. People will not get off at Weston and hop on a bus to go to airport with luggage. Those people as we all know feel LRT will interfer with the car because during a presentation to sell townhouses up at Eglinton and Kipling I think it was, the presentation showed the LRT in the middle of the road. That conjures up lefthand turns or U-turns aka St Clair.
Palma
Senior Member
This is so true. There will never be less than 1 lane. Perhaps they are thinking about the bike lanes being added and sidewalks made wider and where presently there are 2 lanes for cars during rush hour will become one lane even during rush hour. I read somewhere that to allow this whole Eglinton connects, delivery vehicles would happen not along Eglinton but behind lane ways which would be expanded. There are residents concerned that those lane ways will be expanded (as land or houses go up for sale) and there will be traffic going through their neighbourhoods because there will be no parking on Eglinton.
To allow wider sidewalks, bike lanes in both direction and 1 lane parking in each direction plus 2 lanes of traffic in each direction is not possible
Palma
Senior Member
I do not recall that. I heard them say even with the land sale there is still room for the LRT. Something like 45m width, Now I am not sure if thats from centre of the road or what. Now I did leave early from the presentation or perhaps just did not hear the part of losing bike lanes as it appears most of the people talking when I was there were against it because of interference to cars, left-hand turns, over head wires where LRT will be running
crs1026
Superstar
I recall discussion about the Martin Grove intersection in particular in which that comment was made.
Interestingly, the EA recommened new roadways to address the volume of turns at Martin Grove that would require more than 45 meters of roadway. This option may no longer be feasible.
http://thecrosstown.ca/sites/defaul...port-section-2-intro-martin-grove-to-jane.pdf
At other locations, the study recommends right turn lanes at Kipling, Islington, etc. I'm not sure if those fit any more, either.
Another observation about the traffic study in that EA is that it was predicated on an absence of traffic priority for LRT. The study assumed that LRT would stop for red lights in the east-west direction, and proceed in the same cycle as auto traffic. If Crosstown West ever comes to be, this needs revisiting. Lack of traffic priority for the LRT is a potential contributor to a "street car" level performance, expecially since the traffic study recommends a 120 second light cycle. There's no advantage in far-side loading platforms unless you have traffic priority to support it.
- Paul
Interestingly, the EA recommened new roadways to address the volume of turns at Martin Grove that would require more than 45 meters of roadway. This option may no longer be feasible.
http://thecrosstown.ca/sites/defaul...port-section-2-intro-martin-grove-to-jane.pdf
At other locations, the study recommends right turn lanes at Kipling, Islington, etc. I'm not sure if those fit any more, either.
Another observation about the traffic study in that EA is that it was predicated on an absence of traffic priority for LRT. The study assumed that LRT would stop for red lights in the east-west direction, and proceed in the same cycle as auto traffic. If Crosstown West ever comes to be, this needs revisiting. Lack of traffic priority for the LRT is a potential contributor to a "street car" level performance, expecially since the traffic study recommends a 120 second light cycle. There's no advantage in far-side loading platforms unless you have traffic priority to support it.
- Paul
Napoleon
Active Member
I can't even imagine installing a new LRT without transit signal priority. I think that's part of the minimum package that distinguishes LRT from streetcars. Imagine how much longer it would take to get somewhere without it.
1overcosc
Active Member
Has it ever been stated whether or not the surface east portion of the Crosstown is being built with signal priority? I would assume yes, but this is Toronto so you never know.
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
The average speed in the west was projected in the same EA to be 28 to 31 km/h. I'm not sure if it was with or without TCP, but I'd hope they're using the same operation assumptions as in the traffic study.:
The vehicle’s average speed including stops is projected to be 28-31 km/hr in the west surface section, 22-25 km/hr in the east surface section and 32 km/hr underground.
http://thecrosstown.ca/sites/defaul...udies-and-major-functional-design-options.pdf
Monarch Butterfly
Superstar
Except that the weather (IE. the temperatures) helped clear the path of ice and snow. Normally, the city does not clear the bike path along Eglington of ice or snow.
DonValleyRainbow
Senior Member
It was never supposed to be ST, and now it's reverting to the original LRT plan that the province committed to paying for though.
Steve X
Senior Member
It's done under a simulation, actually conditions could be different. Considering how long it takes the city to repair TCP signals for current bus/streetcar signals, a broken antenna could screw over the entire Eglinton line.
Most streetcar lines in the city have transit priority. All streetcars have the antenna to trigger it but not all intersections allow such thing. The question is how much priority will the LRT get compared to lets say St Clair.