[drum118]

Great stuff, so pretty much all of South Etobicoke will be screwed this summer and wont be able to get anywhere reliably.

Not only this, but they'll have to deal with a sewer rehabilitation project on The Queensway, then another sewer rehabilitation project on Lake Shore by the Mimico area.

Pure all around madness.

What are your options to deal with this Mess???

 

[reinventingthewheel]

Gardiner Expressway to see yearlong lane closures starting next week to allow for ‘critical’ repairs​

I haven’t read the article as I’m not subscribed. All I see is the byline which describes a very minor loss:

Beginning April 7, the Gardiner Expressway will be reduced from four to three westbound lanes between Park Lawn Road and Grand Avenue.

Is that all? If so, have the naysayers considered how insignificant this will be so long as the westbound Gardiner remains at 2 lanes through Strachan-Dufferin?

 

[Amare]

What are your options to deal with this Mess???

The ship has long sailed on what they could've done. One option would've been to bring forward the watermain work so it doesnt intertwine with the Gardiner work, but that option is long gone.

 

[innsertnamehere]

I'd assumed that the elevated section between Dufferin and Strachan was going to be gone if the Gardiner was removed. Everything in the east would have been gone. What were the limits in the west where the elevated would remain?

Of course the early 2000s plan would have replaced the west with the ramp to the Front Street Extension, and presumably to Lakeshore West, just east of the CNE - but that one died before the last knock down the Gardiner plan (or has it really been 20 years?).

The hybrid option (the only demolition seriously considered by anyone other than pundits) only contemplated demolition east of Jarvis.

Both the bridge replacements on the western Gardiner starting this week and the ongoing deck replacement are on parts of the Gardiner never officially proposed for demolition.

 

[innsertnamehere]

I haven’t read the article as I’m not subscribed. All I see is the byline which describes a very minor loss:

Is that all? If so, have the naysayers considered how insignificant this will be so long as the westbound Gardiner remains at 2 lanes through Strachan-Dufferin?

I do agree it shouldn't be a major issue as long as the other part of the highway is at 2 lanes - but it is after the Lakeshore on-ramp which means volumes jump a massive amount right before the lane closure. We'll have to see. Also, the construction schedule for it has the lane closure running to the end of 2026, which puts it about 6-9 months longer than the current schedule for the elevated deck replacement - it will be a major issue during those 6-9 months (albeit not as painful as the current lane closures).

 

[PL1]

I just saw that the City is suing WSP Canada Inc for $36 Million for consulting work that lead to 8 months of delays on the Jarvis to Cherry section

 

[turbanplanner]

What are your options to deal with this Mess???

This reminds me of when the 501 route was closed for basically 7 out of 10 years

The old corkscrew one? At minimum, it was dilapedated like the rest of the Gardiner and had to be completely rebuilt, so what was there would be totally demolished in any case even if to rebuild an exact replica.
I recall the thinking was getting people off the Gardiner sooner was better, and this offramp has more queue space to avoid backups on the elevated section, but there likely was little understanding of the explosive change in demand for road space in the area.
Rideshares were also an esoteric thing not even thought of at the time the EA was approved back in 2013. That there would be thousands of requests in that immediate area now on a Saturday evening was not imagined by anyone when the plans were approved and that cars would be weaving in an out to access the then unplanned underground parking garages. or stopping and blocking lanes to let out passengers weaving to the opposite side of Harbour Street.

The idiotic part is requiring everyone to move left 5 lanes to make the turn onto york, and the "block" that they have to wait on holds a whopping 6 cars so the left arrow is wasted.

So glad we totally avoided tearing it down for a boulevard that would've taken a quarter of the time. /s

And how would you deal with the construction required to do that? And how would it absorb all the increased traffic?

 

[zang]

And how would you deal with the construction required to do that? And how would it absorb all the increased traffic?

Let me cut you off here. Do I want to hear again how you absolutely positively have to drive because taking the GO is icky? No.

 

[turbanplanner]

Let me cut you off here. Do I want to hear again how you absolutely positively have to drive because taking the GO is icky? No.

Why are you putting words in my mouth? I've never attacked your character, and for the record I love taking the GO.

My issue is that several lines only run in peak direction, if you commute the "wrong" way or don't start work at 9am you're SOL for several of the lines. And what about the people who don't live near a GO line?

 

[nfitz]

My issue is that several lines only run in peak direction, if you commute the "wrong" way or don't start work at 9am you're SOL for several of the lines. And what about the people who don't live near a GO line?

Shit out of luck? There's off-peak bus service into Union (except perhaps for the Richmond Hill line). The bus serves the stations, so those who don't live near a station can still drive to a station.

 

[T3G]

But those buses usually take far longer than the GO train line even when traffic is near 0, never mind during peak times. No one who values their time would use them if they have access to a car.

Right now (2:46 PM), Milton GO to Union is a 50 minute drive vs. 1 hour 45 minutes by GO bus. And that's the counterpeak direction!!!

 

[smallspy]

But those buses usually take far longer than the GO train line even when traffic is near 0, never mind during peak times. No one who values their time would use them if they have access to a car.

You'd think that, and yet something like 90% of the people coming or going from downtown pre-COVID on GO had access to a car - and that included using the buses where and when there weren't trains.

So maybe they knew something you didn't?

Dan

 

[nfitz]

Right now (2:46 PM), Milton GO to Union is a 50 minute drive vs. 1 hour 45 minutes by GO bus. And that's the counterpeak direction!!!

Milton GO and Mondays are bit cherry-picking. Also I see 1'25" not 1'45" on the current schedule for the 2:15 PM departure. The 3:15 PM is 1'35"

But check some of the others. At the other extreme, the Meadowvale to Union (Bay and Front) 12:50 pm is only 45 minutes (and that route has arrived early when I took it). Google maps says that when leave Meadowvale GO in a car at 12:50 PM (on a Monday) that I arrive around 1:40 p.m; yes can be as fast as 30 minutes. But I'd take 45 minutes on GO any time - where I can actually work, sleep, or watch Netflix - to 30 minutes of driving (or the 50 minutes of stressful driving!)

Also (pre-Covid), compare the bus times from the Stouffville route, which has the bus-only and HOV lanes down the 404/DVP.

Not perfect - but not SOL.

 

[T3G]

You'd think that, and yet something like 90% of the people coming or going from downtown pre-COVID on GO had access to a car - and that included using the buses where and when there weren't trains.

So maybe they knew something you didn't?

Dan

Well, everyone has their own reasons. I myself never choose to use the bus when a car is available. I would sooner drive down to Oakville and transfer to LSW there, only I don't always have access to the car, and the 22 has appallingly bad frequencies. So I suffer.

Milton GO and Mondays are bit cherry-picking. Also I see 1'25" not 1'45" on the current schedule for the 2:15 PM departure. The 3:15 PM is 1'35"

But check some of the others. At the other extreme, the Meadowvale to Union (Bay and Front) 12:50 pm is only 45 minutes (and that route has arrived early when I took it). Google maps says that when leave Meadowvale GO in a car at 12:50 PM (on a Monday) that I arrive around 1:40 p.m; yes can be as fast as 30 minutes. But I'd take 45 minutes on GO any time - where I can actually work, sleep, or watch Netflix - to 30 minutes of driving (or the 50 minutes of stressful driving!)

Also (pre-Covid), compare the bus times from the Stouffville route, which has the bus-only and HOV lanes down the 404/DVP.

Not perfect - but not SOL.

It's not cherry picking, it's that there are wildly different travel times along the route at different times. I have been pleasantly surprised by later evening departures that absolutely fly, but I have also spent far more time than I would have liked to sitting in traffic, wasting time. The problem might be made a little better if GO was less terrible at anticipating where traffic is and diverting buses, but I have been stuck on far, far too many buses that drove right into Gardiner traffic at midday on weekdays where there was nothing going at all, looking out the windows at fast moving traffic on Lake Shore. Weekends when the weather is nice are the absolute worst, and counter peak traffic on warm evenings is also not enjoyable.

Even if the Gardiner was packed, I have never been on a car journey into Toronto that takes as long as the GO bus ride does, because the GO bus has to meander all through Mississauga first, and if there is traffic, I have options to take alternative routes. Especially if my final destination is further uptown than the Union station area.

There's no acceptable transit where there are GO buses downtown.

 

[nfitz]

There's no acceptable transit where there are GO buses downtown.

In your opinion perhaps. I've absolutely loved it when I've had a meeting in Meadowvale and have to return to a downtown Toronto office mid-day.