lenaitch
Senior Member
I think it is a prudent step in the defence of North America.
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- Thread starter Monarch Butterfly
- Start date
UtakataNoAnnex
Senior Member
Under normalized relations with the US this something certainly to explore...but with this current administration it should be a big fat, "Hell no!!" Do we really want to share a new missal defense program with someone whose threatened our sovereignty...even suggesting using force to acquire us? At best, this is likely be used as a Trojan horse to get at us...so we should stay as far away from this as possible, until least (and hopefully) there's a regime change down there, IMO.
...beside a "Dome" made under fevered delusion will likely be flimsy at best. It even says so with "Golden" as it's brand exercise. /bleh
Admiral Beez
Superstar
Of course those directed effected, undocumented Venezuelans cannot vote. I am referring to the Venezuelan community in the US made up of naturalized and US-born citizens who are now about to see their cousins rounded up and deported. These folks overwhelmingly voted for Trump and are now crying foul.
Venezuelans who supported Trump now feel cheated: ‘They used us to win votes’
The Venezuelan community in the United States, which largely supported the Republican, is disappointed by the new administration’s policies against them, especially the withdrawal of protection for exiles
english.elpais.com
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UtakataNoAnnex
Senior Member
Not to beleaguer this further here, because they are not the ones effected by this.Of course those directed effected, undocumented Venezuelans cannot vote. I am referring to the Venezuelan community in the US made up of naturalized and US-born citizens who are now about to see their cousins rounded up and deported. These folks overwhelmingly voted for Trump and are now crying foul.
Venezuelans who supported Trump now feel cheated: ‘They used us to win votes’
The Venezuelan community in the United States, which largely supported the Republican, is disappointed by the new administration’s policies against them, especially the withdrawal of protection for exiles
....to be clear though, you are talking about entirely different issue where people who don't vote for their own best interests and/or to save themselves. Which doesn't just effect this demographic, but entire swaths of folks who screw themselves at the polls by supporting those who will eventually have them up against a wall either figuratively or even literally. There are a variety reason why they do this, but usually it stems from their own hates, fears, ignorance and misunderstandings. It's an entirely bewildering, /head-desking phenomenon for people who don't listen to reason and don't think things through because the thing they're supporting grinds the axes they want grounded. Even if they end up being sacrificed for it. What can I say?
EBT
Active Member
This would be about the dumbest thing for Canada to get involved with. Donald Trump has vowed to take a wrecking ball to Canada's economy, and he is making good on that pledge. Trump has threatened Canada's sovereignty, and he won't stop talking about it although he did say he didn't think military force would be necessary. Isn't that nice of him? Did you ever think that you would ever hear an American president talk like this about Canada? Trump likes to talk like a mob boss. And against this backdrop the "geniuses" working in the Defense Department are discussing with the American's joining Trump's hairbrained "Golden Dome" project?
When I read reports that Trump said Canada had asked to be part of the "Golden Dome" I thought he was lying again. Of course, in making the announcement Trump used it as another opportunity to deride Canada. "The Canadians want to be a part of it and of course we will end up protecting them". I was disappointed when Carney's office confirmed that talks were underway (Carney has some really stupid people advising him).
A "Golden Dome" would be a massive money pit that Canada should not want to have anything to do with it.
The reality is the Americans do not have air defense systems that can reliably take out all incoming threats. They cannot even defend against hypersonic ballistic missiles created by Yemen one of the poorest countries on earth. A few weeks ago, a Yemenis hypersonic missile struck Ben Gurion airport. In order to strike Ben Gurion Airport Yemen's missile was able to evade detection and neutralization by FIVE different air defense system:
- THAAD Terminal High Altitude Area Defense (US)
- Patriot Missile Batteries (US)
- Iron Dome (Israel)
- David’s Sling (Israel)
- Arrow Missile Defense System (Israel)
The Americans and Israeli's threw everything they had at this missile fired by the Houthis but could not stop it and this is not a first. In October Iran was able to land over a dozen ballistic missiles inside the Nevatim air base which is the most secure base in Israel. At the time Israel did not have the THAAD system, but it had the Patriot missile batteries, Iron Dome, David's Sling and the Arrow Defense system all integrated with the American AN/TPY-2 radar system which is the most advanced radar the Americans have, and they were not able to defeat the Iranian barrage. Below is video of the Iranian missiles hitting the air base.
If the very best of American and Israeli air defense systems cannot defeat missiles from Yemen and Iran how will the Americans come up with a "Golden Dome" to defeat Russian or Chinese ballistic missiles that are even more formidable! And what about EMP atmospheric explosions? Ballistic missiles don't have to strike the ground in order to wipe out a country. Google EMP attack!
If I was PM Carney, I would announce that we have considered the American option, but we don't see any value for Canada. If the Americans need to position some of their "Golden Dome" missiles systems on Canadian soil we will be open for discussion, but we will not pay for the privilege and we insist that Trump starts treating Canada with respect. We already pay 40% of the price tag for NORAD which exists largely to defend the US. The Soviets were not interested in targeting Ottawa. Maybe it is time for Canada to dissolve NORAD since it doesn't benefit us much? How would the Americans like that?
Donald Trump has made it clear that he considers Canada an enemy. He has vowed to destroy our economy and to annex us. Under these circumstances why would we ever cooperate in a defensive anti-ballistic missile system with the Americans? We need to be spending billions on conventional air defense systems that can take out American aircraft and missiles if the unthinkable happens.
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Admiral Beez
Superstar
I'd also want Carney to rebut with a solid plan to get us to 2% GDP on defence spending. That's our international commitment. New subs, destroyers, fighter and maritime patrol aircraft, armoured vehicles and critically new trucks and logistics capabilities, small arms, communications kit and uniforms updates, recruitment programs, compensation/pension advances, and base housing expansions and upgrades would go a long way towards this.
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lenaitch
Senior Member
I wasn't commenting so much on the pros, cons ore effectiveness of the proposed Golden Dome system; I know little about it. I was commenting on Canada being willing step up and pay to protect our sovereign territory. If we are not at the table, we will have no say on how the US defends its sovereign integrity, and rest assured it will do so at our expense whether we like it or not. They will simply not leave their northern flank unprotected. They already traverse the NWP with impunity and, if they felt it necessary, would overfly Canadian airspace without our permission. In either case, what is our ability to do anything about it?
DSCToronto
Superstar
Sadly, you are absolutely right. The US (and, to be honest, probably every country!) will do what is good for them and not for 'allies'. The difference with Trump is that he makes it quite clear from his actions that treaties are only obeyed if they suit his current ideas and allies will change based on situations. Trump simply does not try to obfuscate or pretend and thoughts pass directly from his mind to his mouth without the (more normal) diplomatic massaging!
Thoughts pass directly based on what people implant into his mind or the shiny object he saw today, I.e., letting reopen Alcatraz! Yesterday, he incorrectly described videos and news reports about “white genocide” in South Africa. He had no idea what his props were, he just said what someone told him they were.
UtakataNoAnnex
Senior Member
picard102
Senior Member
Not yet.
guavadelic
Active Member
The folks at the DND seem to be about the last people that have yet to realize Canada's relationship with the U.S. has changed.
Northern Light
Superstar
The Donald's administration has seen fit to revoke Harvard's right to enroll foreign students:
This doesn't just effect new enrollments either, but existing students. Foreign students comprise 27% of Harvard's student body.
This doesn't just effect new enrollments either, but existing students. Foreign students comprise 27% of Harvard's student body.
afransen
Senior Member
He's trying to make an example of an institution that has defied him.
guavadelic
Active Member
Following the Victor Orban playbook to a tee