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christiesplits said:
Metrolinx setting new targets for fare evasion.

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If you're someone who always pay their fare, then none of this is concerning. Quotas aren't surprising.
In regards to potential profiling, the officers will literally walk the entire length of the train, checking every single rider. Hardly discriminatory.
The guy that CBC interviewed argued that GO transit shouldn't be so reliant on fares for revenue. lol! Where do they find these people?
 
Why would you set a quota for the number of infractions that you expect to find, rather than a much more reasonable and sympathetic target of trying to check, say, everyone on a train in an interstation segment?

What happens if an officer fails to meet their daily quota? Are they going to take my Presto card and snap it in half and then fine me for not having a fare? :D
 
Bojaxs said:
If you're someone who always pay their fare, then none of this is concerning. Quotas aren't surprising.
In regards to potential profiling, the officers will literally walk the entire length of the train, checking every single rider. Hardly discriminatory.
The guy that CBC interviewed argued that GO transit shouldn't be so reliant on fares for revenue. lol! Where do they find these people?
Click to expand...
I mean...hes not wrong....Im a supporter of free transit. Sure it would be expensive but it really should be a thing.

T3G said:
Why would you set a quota for the number of infractions that you expect to find, rather than a much more reasonable and sympathetic target of trying to check, say, everyone on a train in an interstation segment?

What happens if an officer fails to meet their daily quota? Are they going to take my Presto card and snap it in half and then fine me for not having a fare?
Click to expand...
Id bet the reason they came up with this is too many officers let people off with warnings, enough that it no longer deters people from paying.

They mention in the article there is yet to be any disciplinary actions, but maybe they adjust the average after a certain point, if the amount of fines keeps dropping maybe they adjust it.
Again, probably just a way of weeding out officers who dont fine people.
 
generalcanada said:
I mean...hes not wrong....Im a supporter of free transit. Sure it would be expensive but it really should be a thing.


Id bet the reason they came up with this is too many officers let people off with warnings, enough that it no longer deters people from paying.

They mention in the article there is yet to be any disciplinary actions, but maybe they adjust the average after a certain point, if the amount of fines keeps dropping maybe they adjust it.
Again, probably just a way of weeding out officers who dont fine people.
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There's no such thing as "free". If the government in completely on the hook for transit, then they'll simply raise our taxes to cover the costs. Very much like our healthcare system. One way or another, it comes out of our pocket.
 
Bojaxs said:
If you're someone who always pay their fare, then none of this is concerning. Quotas aren't surprising.
In regards to potential profiling, the officers will literally walk the entire length of the train, checking every single rider. Hardly discriminatory.
The guy that CBC interviewed argued that GO transit shouldn't be so reliant on fares for revenue. lol! Where do they find these people?
Click to expand...
I think the discriminatory part could happen more with how they deal with fare evaders.
Does the little old lady riding with her grandkids get treated the same as the young dude riding with e-bike, when neither of them have paid a fare? In theory yes, but not always in practice, even if not intentional.
 
Bojaxs said:
There's no such thing as "free". If the government in completely on the hook for transit, then they'll simply raise our taxes to cover the costs. Very much like our healthcare system. One way or another, it comes out of our pocket.
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Yes? like thats how our healthcare system (should) works.

"free" transit "free" healthcare "free" highways. They all serve the public interest and are better off when you dont have to worry about paying fees.

Its been brought up and studied before and apperently the people who end up using it are people who would walk or bike. Still it evidently helps SOME people who wouldnt be able to afford it

Of course the resistance to spending tax dollars is a completely separate topic. Every country in the world is in massive debt for a reason *cough* Reagan *cough*
 
How many commuter rail services are free? I suspect the number isn't that high. In my travels I have never ridden any free system. So I suggest we not aim for pie-in-the-sky free transit and just focus on the issue at hand.

The targets for some of the lines seem questionable.

Being a Milton line rider, it doesn't surprise me to see the low amount of fare inspections. Having been riding since June regularly, I have yet to be fare inspected.

Richmond Hill and Barrie have very low fare inspection compared to their targets. Whereas Kitchener and Lakeshore West have high targets and even higher inspections.

How are they setting these targets and inspections? Do they correlate well to ridership? Why are some lines not meeting their inspection targets?
 
The funniest part is apperently the 9% fare evasion rate on the KW line. Twice as high as other lines
Really makes me curious, how do they know how many riders they have? How do they know how many dont tap?
Previous fare enforcement officer stats?
 
vic said:
I think the discriminatory part could happen more with how they deal with fare evaders.
Does the little old lady riding with her grandkids get treated the same as the young dude riding with e-bike, when neither of them have paid a fare? In theory yes, but not always in practice, even if not intentional.
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We recently spent time in Nice, France. They have an excellent transit system that we rode often.

There are signs posted in every bus / tram that non payment of fare will result in a 100€ fine.

We were on a bus that was subject to a random check. Six members of transit security boarded, blocking all the exits and checked everyone. The checking went quickly.

Those who did not have proof of payment were escorted off and issued the fine. We're told by locals that there are no exceptions.
 
On twitter, presto card replied to a comment that if u have a monthly pass you will not be able to add it digitally to your phone wallet,
 
A couple of weekends back, we were on the Kitchener line from Union to Bloor, about 3 quad-seats in from the stairs on the upper level. Fare enforcement didn't even get close to us, as pretty much nobody in the first bunch of quads had paid, so they spent all their time writing them up. No chance in hell they would have made it through the whole train at that rate. heh.
 
vic said:
A couple of weekends back, we were on the Kitchener line from Union to Bloor, about 3 quad-seats in from the stairs on the upper level. Fare enforcement didn't even get close to us, as pretty much nobody in the first bunch of quads had paid, so they spent all their time writing them up. No chance in hell they would have made it through the whole train at that rate. heh.
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I guess this is why they focus on the Kitchener line.
 
vic said:
A couple of weekends back, we were on the Kitchener line from Union to Bloor, about 3 quad-seats in from the stairs on the upper level. Fare enforcement didn't even get close to us, as pretty much nobody in the first bunch of quads had paid, so they spent all their time writing them up. No chance in hell they would have made it through the whole train at that rate. heh.
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I haven't seen as much fare inspection since Covid on Lakeshore. But I can't remember many people (if any) getting caught when I've had them going through the train.

As for the quota and rate? They have lots and lots of stats on how many people they catch per inspection, etc. I suspect they've noticed that the stats for certain inspectors are a lot lower than others. I wonder if they can check the taps on their machine versus time of day, and the fails versus fines given.

But 6,000 a month is a lot. Is that really correct? For a 20-day months and 8-hour day, that comes down to writing a ticket every 96 seconds. As I said, on trains when I've seen inspection, they'd easily take 3-4 minutes to walk through the top level - and not get anyone. And if they do, 96 seconds each seems unlikely - the first thing most will do is spend a while searching their pockets for a "card". Heck, I've seen some people take 60 seconds to find their card when they have tapped!
 
many7695 said:
On twitter, presto card replied to a comment that if u have a monthly pass you will not be able to add it digitally to your phone wallet,
Click to expand...
I looked at the answer on twitter and it didn't seem to be worded well. I have a TTC monthly pass on my Presto card and after an update on the app i was able to convert that card to my Google wallet.
 
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