[drum118]

Frieght trains can't "double stack" in Europe because of all the over head infrastructure for electric trains.

This makes frieght trains less profitable in Europe and results in more trucks on their roads and highways.

It has has to do more with tunnels, bridges, walkways than overhead systems itself. There are a few places in Europe and the world where double stacks can run under wire.

Rolling stock in Europe is way behind NA stock to the point back in 2012 I was seeing single axles on cars under 40'.. Very rare to see a 50's car.

Making up and breaking down freight trains in Europe is very labour with the chain coupling and starting to change to modern coupler along with passenger trains and short what is done in NA.

There is a movement to more trucks on trains and get them off the highways these days

 

[smallspy]

CN literally installed the wires themselves in Montreal - and it was their choice.

They didn't own them at the end. And yet they still ran under it.

That is the problem with RR in NA where they can run under other RR with overhead but refuse to allow it on their own line. CSX has no problems running wire on the east coast yet when the Purple Line wanted to run in a short section of CSX corridor, the Purple line had to jump through all kind of hoops to do so even building a crash wall between CSX two main lines and the new LRT ROW.

I don't think that's a North America specific problem. It strikes me that it's more of an issue with risk, and trying to avoid it. That can happen anywhere - although I would concede that it does seem that in many ways we are more risk-adverse here in North America.

You can see both electric and diesel freight trains under wire in Europe with no problem other been short ones under 40 cars and single levels compare to 100-275 in NA that are double stack.

But that's more of a function of how the railways are laid out in Europe, with one organization owning the track and allowing others access to operate on them. That kind of thing just doesn't apply here.

Freight trains can't "double stack" in Europe because of all the overhead infrastructure for electric trains.

If you want to want to be really pedantic, it's actually not the wires at all. It's all of the structures around the railways that limit it - the structure gauge.

There are loads of places in Europe that don't have overhead wire but still aren't able to run equipment capable of handling double-stacked containers. Just like there are places in North America that can't.

This makes freight trains less profitable in Europe and results in more trucks on their roads and highways.

There are loads of reasons why freight trains are less profitable: the structure gauge and inability to handle larger freight cars is just a small part of it. It could be argued that access costs, inability to path trains and train length limits are bigger factors to it.

Dan

 

[just east of the creek]

They didn't own them at the end. And yet they still ran under it.


I don't think that's a North America specific problem. It strikes me that it's more of an issue with risk, and trying to avoid it. That can happen anywhere - although I would concede that it does seem that in many ways we are more risk-adverse here in North America.


But that's more of a function of how the railways are laid out in Europe, with one organization owning the track and allowing others access to operate on them. That kind of thing just doesn't apply here.


If you want to want to be really pedantic, it's actually not the wires at all. It's all of the structures around the railways that limit it - the structure gauge.

There are loads of places in Europe that don't have overhead wire but still aren't able to run equipment capable of handling double-stacked containers. Just like there are places in North America that can't.


There are loads of reasons why freight trains are less profitable: the structure gauge and inability to handle larger freight cars is just a small part of it. It could be argued that access costs, inability to path trains and train length limits are bigger factors to it.

Dan

Europe is far more fragmented in its ability to move freight cross border(s) then passenger rail. Plus all of the above - there are just a lot of inconsistencies. Far more then passenger which continues to see improvements, even through rail company issues, and additions, such as the continuing addition of night trains etc. A company I do some work for in Europe is very hopeful that the 'Starline' program (which is an EU proposal in a planning stage) will allow for much more rapid movements of freight by rail to a long list of destinations, leading to some sort of last mile regional trucking system to move the freight to final destination.

 

[urbancog]

For all of that, not only is significant electrification an ongoing part of the plan[ but there are major moves being made to support it.

Some of those are highly visible and have been discussed here on UT. Some you'll just have to wait for....

Already announced, and again reiterated on page 13 of the USRC Liaison Committee presentation of 14-April-2026, is electrification of:

• Lakeshore West: Union to Burlington
• Lakeshore East: Union to Oshawa
• Kitchener: Union to Pearson only. (Malton, Bramalea & beyond no longer included.)
• Barrie: Union to Allendale
• Stouffville: Union to Old Elm

With the agreement in principle, between Metrolinx & CN, to buy enough of the Halton Sub for "Dedicated Track, Bramalea to Silver" that would allow eventual electrification all the way to Kitchener. But, an environmental assessment will be needed first. Hopefully we'll be really good at the electrification process by the time it's approved.

Doug Ford's GO 2.0 announcement included dedicated tracks to Milton, so that could be electrified when it's built, but don't expect any more detail until just before the next provincial election!

Hopefully there's more, perhaps related to Alto, but "Some you'll just have to wait for...."

 

[CMQSD402F9011]

Europe is far more fragmented in its ability to move freight cross border(s) then passenger rail. Plus all of the above - there are just a lot of inconsistencies. Far more then passenger which continues to see improvements, even through rail company issues, and additions, such as the continuing addition of night trains etc. A company I do some work for in Europe is very hopeful that the 'Starline' program (which is an EU proposal in a planning stage) will allow for much more rapid movements of freight by rail to a long list of destinations, leading to some sort of last mile regional trucking system to move the freight to final destination.

I know the former Soviet Union Railways can’t run double stack intermodals because of the catenary on their lines. Wouldn’t their freight be profitable?

 

[drum118]

Georgetown follow by Brampton will see two type of EA's meetings in May for upgrading the Halton Sub. One will be by ML and the other by CN. More EA's will happen for Halton Sub and KW expansion in the coming months.

 

[just east of the creek]

Been a few years since I've been to Russia and then it was mostly St Petersburg, so I cannot really comment.

I know the former Soviet Union Railways can’t run double stack intermodals because of the catenary on their lines. Wouldn’t their freight be profitable

 

[Yeltsa Kcir]

Georgetown follow by Brampton will see two type of EA's meetings in May for upgrading the Halton Sub. One will be by ML and the other by CN. More EA's will happen for Halton Sub and KW expansion in the coming months.

What's an EA meeting?

 

[Northern Light]

What's an EA meeting?

Environmental Assessment

 

[drum118]

April 27
A new 5? track signal bridge has been installed on the Lakeshore East Line at the Don River with only 3 tracks signals in place.

Metrolinx has removed the west track for the Richmond Hill Line North of the old signal where the crossover is to Union Station Corridor. The Signal bridge is being replace with a 3 light signal mast currently facing east out of service with water warming light at the top

 

[crs1026]

April 27
A new 5? track signal bridge has been installed on the Lakeshore East Line at the Don River with only 3 tracks signals in place.

The interesting detail is the 2-head eastward signals, ie a new shorter block spacing likely protecting East Harbour platforms, and hinting at new block spacing to increase throughput.
I see that there are masts for two morectracks, but the signals have not been mounted… unlike the Kitchener Line where all sorts of signals were installed in 2014 for tracks that are only now getting built, and have sat unused for sll this time.

- Paul

 

[Metroscapes]

Freight trains can't "double stack" in Europe because of all the overhead infrastructure for electric trains.

This makes freight trains less profitable in Europe and results in more trucks on their roads and highways.

Double-stacked freight was a main consideration in the 2010 GO electrification EA. The catenary system was assumed to require a 7.1m vertical clearance from top-of-rail to accommodate double-stacked freight. That also fed into a high-level screening of how may bridges needed to be rebuilt or reworked; there were 28 in total at the time for just the Lakeshore and Kitchener lines.

 

[drum118]

The interesting detail is the 2-head eastward signals, ie a new shorter block spacing likely protecting East Harbour platforms, and hinting at new block spacing to increase throughput.
I see that there are masts for two morectracks, but the signals have not been mounted… unlike the Kitchener Line where all sorts of signals were installed in 2014 for tracks that are only now getting built, and have sat unused for sll this time.

- Paul

2 of the 3 signals are in service and was surprise to see signals for 5 tracks when the corridor is only 4 tracks east of Eastern Ave. I believe the East Harbour Station only has 4 tracks but could be wrong.

Seen some of those signals on the KW line not in service after been installed

 

[Allandale25]

Posted by Michael Lindsay about work taking place on the Barrie Line this weekend.

 

[SubHuman]

I was initially confused for several seconds at what line they could be trying to represent in this strange and somewhat misleading image on their printed paper delivered in the area. Luckily the description makes it more clear, as does the different image in the online version.
https://assets.metrolinx.com/image/..._Weekend_Rail_Construction_Kitchener_Line.pdf
(The Kitchener and Barrie lines there run in a north-south direction, not east-west and parallel to Bloor St W., before they then bend to run in a more diagonal direction going towards Union Station. And the No Frills at 222 Lansdowne is definitely south of Dundas St W, not way north of it and near Bloor. )