[A 6264]

From Yonge to Don Mills was more of a proposal. Finch West to Finch (Yonge) was fully funded with an approved plan and timeline by the province.

According to Wikipedia's page on Line 6:
"In March 2010, the Ontario government eliminated the proposed section of the line between Finch West and Finch because of budget constraints."
Since then, there have been proposals brought up by Toronto city council, but none have been endorsed by the province.
You could fill a book with Toronto area transit plans proposed in the past, including projects approved but then unapproved.

 

[Steve X]

If Line 5 does open on Feb 8, it would be interesting to see if it could run in snow storms unlike Finch, or if they would turn back trains at Laird at the very least as the underground section obviously wouldn’t have snow to deal with.

They were running normally today in this freezing weather. So there’s more hope unlike Finch which is having issues everyday.

 

[urbanclient]

According to Wikipedia's page on Line 6:
"In March 2010, the Ontario government eliminated the proposed section of the line between Finch West and Finch because of budget constraints."

It's not so simple as 'budget constraints' suggests. There would likely need to be costly, contested expropriation, for temporary or permanent interests. The ROW east of Keele is too narrow in certain sections to fit 4 car lanes, a median tram ROW, stop platforms, and sidewalks, much less the addition of turning lanes at intersections. Otherwise, tunnelling would be needed.

Either way, 'budget constraints' clearly come into play, just not in the way many would think.

[...] Right next door you can see the ROW narrows to 33 metres and even less closer to Yonge. And it's effectively narrower for reasons stated above.
View attachment 709890
Here is the legacy residential area in the other Google maps screenshot:
View attachment 709891

In cases like these, the narrowest sections determine tram upgrade viability. There is no way the city fits a tram and four car lanes on Finch [closer to Yonge]. In a theoretical best case scenario you need only 20.6 metres curb-to-curb, and maybe 25-26 metres property line to property line, but in reality you more than likely need at least 22-24 metres curb-to-curb and 30-32 metres property line to property line [to account for 4.2 metres for sidewalks, 3 metres for tram stop platforms and 1-2 metres conservative construction buffer for street widening and sidewalk reconstruction, assuming no grass boulevards, no bike lanes, no turning lanes at intersections like Line 6]

8 metres for tram ROW, 2x8 metres for car lanes in both directions with some buffer for ease of construction etc. and roughly 5 to 7 metres for sidewalks/boulevards. [...] They are not going to build 2.1 metre wide sidewalks sandwiched exactly between the property line and the road surface to cram in a tram + four lanes of traffic in a cross section of 25 metres.
View attachment 709902

https://assets.metrolinx.com/image/upload/v1663240053/Documents/Metrolinx/Finch-West-LRT-FAQs-Revised-June9.pdf

 

[WillTo]

I would like to congratulate Line 6 whose stock footage was used during a Global News piece on high speed rail.

 

[Bordercollie]

So I don't understand why we keep repeating the same thing and expect a different result.

The first time the switches froze due to snow that should have been the first time and last time. Measures should be put into place to prevent it from happening again.

Again it snowed and the line is down. Subway from Victoria park is also down. At least line 1 is running.

On days like this we especially need public transit to work, and when it doesn't it's such a counter productive situation.

 

[Admiral Beez]

So I don't understand why we keep repeating the same thing and expect a different result.

The first time the switches froze due to snow that should have been the first time and last time. Measures should be put into place to prevent it from happening again.

Again it snowed and the line is down. Subway from Victoria park is also down. At least line 1 is running.

On days like this we especially need public transit to work, and when it doesn't it's such a counter productive situation.

If the TTC is only reliable in good weather, I might as well drive. It’s when the weather means I don’t want to drive that I want to take the subway, streetcars and LRTs.

 

[Steve X]

It seems like all the Flexitys in this city are running if people don’t block the tracks. Yes, they do run on line 5. The problems have something to do with this line more than the weather.

 

[Amare]

Here we go again, no service on the entire Finch West line:

Yes the weather is absolutely horrid today, but explain how the TTC streetcar network continues to operate (for the most part), but yet this line cant. Why in the hell are we paying Mosaic, if they cant maintain the line?

Mosaic/Metrolinx I dont care if you cant get proper switch heaters, it's your job to ensure the line is functioning. Station crews at all the switch points and have them manually clear the switches every 30 mins, this excuse of "switch issues" is absolute and pure garbage, and the fact that Metrolinx is accepting this operational idiocy speaks to their ongoing stupidity and ineptitude.

Heck hire some young students to clear the switches, i'm sure they would love to for whatever the pay would be.

 

[robmausser]

Why in the hell are we paying Mosaic, if they cant maintain the line?

This is one of the biggest problems with any of the "Transit city" era projects like Line 5, 6. Its why Metorlinx and Crosslinx sued each other multiple times. The contracts were poorly written. Mosaic basically underbid everyone else because the contracts basically let them do the bare minimum and still be considered meeting their obligations.

The issue here is if you do a P3, you need to be very sure that the consortium is obligated to make sure things are operating smoothly. Not that they hit a certain level of work and say "we've reached our funding limit, cant do that, sorry. Gotta slow down the trains sorry, they are wearing out too fast to meet our funding requirements" etc etc.

Ontop of that, having a separate agency owning, maintaining and operating the line just spells trouble and finger pointing.

 

[nfitz]

Well I guess Line 6 will be closed the next few days..

Probably.

Meanwhile, this afternoon when I checked, there were no streetcar issues, except 503, which was having issues on Kingston Road - with buss! you. Right now the only problems are automobile accidents an police activity.

This is when a line like Finch West should excel - not fail.

If the TTC is only reliable in good weather, I might as well drive. It’s when the weather means I don’t want to drive that I want to take the subway, streetcars and LRTs.

Streetcars are working well today - as usual in a snow storm. This is typical, why say this? I'm glad I'm not driving today!

 

[stove]

Yeah I am just wondering, how come streetcars are tanks but the LRT is very finicky? and are the switches only like at the turning point of the yard and then possibly the terminal spots?

 

[Bordercollie]

Yeah I am just wondering, how come streetcars are tanks but the LRT is very finicky? and are the switches only like at the turning point of the yard and then possibly the terminal spots?

Missmanagement.

It could also be that the flexity's were designed for the TTC'S harsh specs given that they are probably over engineered for Toronto's climate. The Alstom cars have had problems with cab heaters in the winter (Ottawa) and may not have been designed with cold weather in mind as much.
I find that the Flexity fleet also has better heat in the passenger compartment than the Alstom cars.

 

[Jaye101]

Probably.

Meanwhile, this afternoon when I checked, there were no streetcar issues, except 503, which was having issues on Kingston Road - with buss! you. Right now the only problems are automobile accidents an police activity.

This is when a line like Finch West should excel - not fail.

Streetcars are working well today - as usual in a snow storm. This is typical, why say this? I'm glad I'm not driving today!

I was on a Line 1 train between Rosedale and Bloor earlier and the train was losing power every few seconds it wasn't long after that they halted service between Bloor and Eglinton.

The 512 was more reliable than Line 2 in the west end today, which was shut down much of the evening between St George (!!) and Kipling Station. Many people took the 512 as a detour. There was a bit of a wait and plenty a brooms were swept but none the less it did the damn thing. The supervisor along the route told the driver he was going west from St Clair W station, to which the driver replied "which way is that?" in a strong accent. I found the exchange amusing. But you could really see that it was all hands on deck today. Kudos to them. The real test will be how much of the surface sections of the subway will be open for the AM rush.

I wonder, was the TTC consulted during the planning of Line 6? And in what capacity?

Missmanagement.

It could also be that the flexity's were designed for the TTC'S harsh specs given that they are probably over engineered for Toronto's climate. The Alstom cars have had problems with cab heaters in the winter (Ottawa) and may not have been designed with cold weather in mind as much.
I find that the Flexity fleet also has better heat in the passenger compartment than the Alstom cars.

I believe the problem is more with the switches than the vehicles, though there may be problems with the vehicles to which I'm unaware.

 

[Westey]

So I don't understand why we keep repeating the same thing and expect a different result.

The first time the switches froze due to snow that should have been the first time and last time. Measures should be put into place to prevent it from happening again.

Again it snowed and the line is down. Subway from Victoria park is also down. At least line 1 is running.

On days like this we especially need public transit to work, and when it doesn't it's such a counter productive situation.

I was on a Line 1 train between Rosedale and Bloor earlier and the train was losing power every few seconds it wasn't long after that they halted service between Bloor and Eglinton..

I wonder if it's a money-making exercise to cover/roof the subway (e.g. Yonge north of Bloor) and then build over top of it.
(in reality, I think it might make more sense to build a park over the subway and build on adjacent parkland).
Improved reliability. "Found" land. More density close to subway.

 

[ThenWhat]

This is one of the biggest problems with any of the "Transit city" era projects like Line 5, 6. Its why Metorlinx and Crosslinx sued each other multiple times. The contracts were poorly written. Mosaic basically underbid everyone else because the contracts basically let them do the bare minimum and still be considered meeting their obligations.

The issue here is if you do a P3, you need to be very sure that the consortium is obligated to make sure things are operating smoothly. Not that they hit a certain level of work and say "we've reached our funding limit, cant do that, sorry. Gotta slow down the trains sorry, they are wearing out too fast to meet our funding requirements" etc etc.

Ontop of that, having a separate agency owning, maintaining and operating the line just spells trouble and finger pointing.

At some point the provincial government will have to step in, pay whatever it takes to cancel the long-term contracts and consolidate the ownership, maintenance and operation in one organization. It doesn't really matter which organization, as long as there is one clear line of resposibility.
It should happen sooner rather than later. Until then we'll live with this three-headed monster, where every problem is always somebody else's fault.