[Thaboss]

Province isn’t interested in it. City is really pushing for it…even though the study shows a BRT would provide the same service levels at less than half the cost…

Chow did mention during a Q&A after a presser that she’d be open to uploading EglintonEast and Waterfront LRT’s to Metrolinx. I have the video but can’t post to UT (some will claim she never said this).

If brt is seen as the better option why the push for lrt? Are we talking proper grade separated system? Or painting on the road type system,

I'm curious to know when those studies took place, especially considering the rather large population increases in recent years. Do you know ?

How recent was this Q&A?


Anyways. I'm rather invested in this because I live right along this corridor and am a frequent bus rider. The morning rush hour can be insane sometimes..

 

[Thaboss]

You can't upload something if the province isn't interested.........

Not sure that should stop the city from talking and planning about it. Gotta raise the profile of the project to get provincial buy in, no ?

 

[CapitalSeven]

I had the idea that the ridership would eventually overwhelm buses, so that starting with LRT made more sense. But we haven't seen updated ridership projections, I don't think. The EA projected 3-4K riders at peak, whereas they were looking at over 5000 several years ago. So buses could do it but you'd be looking at a very heavy schedule.

 

[mossynukes]

If brt is seen as the better option why the push for lrt?

Because shiny new high-tech rail infrastructure will make the streets look prettier than some Bus Lanes would! Marketing it as an amazing and necessary $__B investment for Scarborough residents will help Chow secure political support. Rationality is an after-thought for this project.

 

[Rainforest]

It seems like the southern part of this route will benefit from LRT, because of the demand level. If it reaches 4K per hour per direction at peak, that will require 60 regular buses or 40 artics per hour, or the LRT.

The end-to-end travel time is not a big issue for the southern section, because the riders who want to travel between Kennedy Stn and UTSC won't take the LRT. They will take Line 2 to STC, and then the express bus. The LRT, on the other hand, will mostly serve shorter trips, taking the residents of highrises along Eg East and Kingston Rd to the subway.

 

[Rainforest]

The northern section seems a nice-to-have but not essential. The demand there is unlikely to exceed the level that the buses can easily handle. Thus, two possibilities come to mind:

1. If minimizing the cost is the only way to get this project going, then the northern part of LRT can be dropped altogether, or replaced with BRT. The LRT would only run from Kennedy Stn to Sheppard/Morningside, or perhaps to Sheppard/Conlins since the tracks will be there anyway (the yard connection).

Buses would handle the connection from the Sheppard/McCowan subway station to UTSC and to Malvern.

2. If more funding can be obtained, then the northern part of the LRT can be built, but with fewer stops. Only stopping at Markham Rd, Neilson, and Sheppard/Morningside, dropping the Shorting, Washburn, Brenyon stops. In this form, the LRT can act as a fast and cheap (at-grade) extension of the Line 4 subway to UTSC.

Residents living between the stops won't be left without service, because the Sheppard buses will continue to run. Buses are needed to serve Sheppard east of Morningside anyway, and those same buses can serve the midblock stops west of Morningside.

 

[Aplus23]

The northern section seems a nice-to-have but not essential. The demand there is unlikely to exceed the level that the buses can easily handle. Thus, two possibilities come to mind:

1. If minimizing the cost is the only way to get this project going, then the northern part of LRT can be dropped altogether, or replaced with BRT. The LRT would only run from Kennedy Stn to Sheppard/Morningside, or perhaps to Sheppard/Conlins since the tracks will be there anyway (the yard connection).

Buses would handle the connection from the Sheppard/McCowan subway station to UTSC and to Malvern.

2. If more funding can be obtained, then the northern part of the LRT can be built, but with fewer stops. Only stopping at Markham Rd, Neilson, and Sheppard/Morningside, dropping the Shorting, Washburn, Brenyon stops. In this form, the LRT can act as a fast and cheap (at-grade) extension of the Line 4 subway to UTSC.

Residents living between the stops won't be left without service, because the Sheppard buses will continue to run. Buses are needed to serve Sheppard east of Morningside anyway, and those same buses can serve the midblock stops west of Morningside.

The northern section is where the MSF will be, east of Morningside & Sheppard on Sheppard

 

[JBR]

The northern section is where the MSF will be, east of Morningside & Sheppard on Sheppard

One report also suggested using the City lands south-east corner of morningside/401

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

The Toronto Zoo should be planning to re-introduce a "Domain Ride" from the Morningside-Sheppard Station to the main entrance of the Toronto Zoo. Unfortunately, we would expect a l-o-n-g walk from the station to the ride, the way Toronto builds connections.

 

[TOtramz]

The curvy section near UTSC seems very problematic as the left turn from ellesmere north on to military trail is a slanted intersection and is very sharp. I wonder how they plan to get massive LRVs to navigate these tight turns?

 

[Northern Light]

The northern section is where the MSF will be, east of Morningside & Sheppard on Sheppard

That certainly was the plan, and may still be, if this bad idea is built out. But....there are reasons this option may come off the table. TBD.

 

[Voltz]

The curvy section near UTSC seems very problematic as the left turn from ellesmere north on to military trail is a slanted intersection and is very sharp. I wonder how they plan to get massive LRVs to navigate these tight turns?

Military Trail is going to be realigned to head straight north from Ellesmere,

The northern section is where the MSF will be, east of Morningside & Sheppard on Sheppard

I don't agree fully with building the northern section, but getting the tracks to the MSF is pretty short.

 

[T3G]

The curvy section near UTSC seems very problematic as the left turn from ellesmere north on to military trail is a slanted intersection and is very sharp. I wonder how they plan to get massive LRVs to navigate these tight turns?

The same way they currently do downtown. The total length of the LRV is not a factor, it is the length of individual sections that dictates how sharp a turn they can negotiate. Notice how, unlike the PCCs and CLRVs, the Flexitys do not have tapered off end caps.

Besides, they don't have to go all the way to the "main" intersection there. They can easily cancel this high speed right turn and make that into a trackway:

 

[Rainforest]

The northern section is where the MSF will be, east of Morningside & Sheppard on Sheppard

Others mentioned that the MSF might end up being south of the 401.

If the MSF is at Sheppard&Conlins, then the LRT needs to cross to the north of 401, reach Sheppard, then go to Conlins. That's about 2.5 km in total from the PanAm Sports Centre.

The rest of the northern section, along Sheppard to McCowan plus the branch to Malvern Centre, is still optional. An argument can be made both for and against those tracks. But if the overall cost is the blocker, then prehaps dropping the optional northern tracks is a fair trade for getting the more essential southern section built.

 

[NIV]

With the Sheppard subway extension looking promising, better to eventually extend the subway farther east of McCowan. Future subway stop at Eglinton and Danforth would help south Scarborough. Take advantage of bus lanes on theses wide roadways