Urban Sky
Senior Member
You will have to tell that (in a compelling tone!) to the communities through which you want to plough. Have a look at the list I just posted. None of these stations were added for any commercial motives…
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- Thread starter innsertnamehere
- Start date
nfitz
Superstar
I'm not saying they shouldn't have some stations. I'm merely surprised at the difference between 100,000 you threw out, and the biggest town on the order of 5,000.
Skirt around the Canadian Shield? How? Which towns would it hit?
The two biggest towns I can think of on the edge of the shield are Kingston (CMA 178,000) and Brockville (CMA 44,000). And of course Peterborough (CMA 150,000). And Ottawa-Hull.
Though I think, with Kingston's expanded boundaries into Pittsburgh Township, that part of it is now actually in the shield. At least from the outcrops I've seen east of the Cataraqui River.
You'd have to get south of the 401 in spots between Kingston and Brockville to avoid the shield - at best you can do is aim for the narrow part ... which is what the GTR did.
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just east of the creek
Senior Member
Not much agriculture on the Canadian Shield…..although many tried in past generations.
micheal_can
Senior Member
Asphodel–Norwood 4,658
Havelock-Belmont-Methuen 5,083
Marmora 1,499
Madoc 1,489
Tweed 6,067
Sharbot Lake 4,555
Tay Valley 5,925
Perth 6,469
Smiths Falls 9,254
These are the built up areas along highway 7/the old Havelock Subdivision. If the line is only HSR, should any of these have a stop? If the line will also have some regular passenger service, how many of these should have stops?
Havelock-Belmont-Methuen 5,083
Marmora 1,499
Madoc 1,489
Tweed 6,067
Sharbot Lake 4,555
Tay Valley 5,925
Perth 6,469
Smiths Falls 9,254
These are the built up areas along highway 7/the old Havelock Subdivision. If the line is only HSR, should any of these have a stop? If the line will also have some regular passenger service, how many of these should have stops?
guavadelic
Active Member
The cities the HSR will stop in have likely already been decided. There will be probably be debates on if stops outside the core of TOR/MTL are added.
lenaitch
Senior Member
That part of the Canadian Shied that dips down to Kingston is called the Frontenac Arch or Frontenac Axis and protrudes down into upstate New York (apologies for the image)
The population cited for Havelock is for the entire amalgamated township of Havelock-Belmont-Methuen. The village itself is about 1700. None of the communities between Peterborough and Perth are much more than a couple of thousand at best. Any station stop would draw on a catchment area, which I suspect is the case for the smaller German stops cited. The problem is, the population north of the proposed route is very small and the population south encroaches on the lakeshore corridor.
I remember reading some local news from the communities when HFR was first floated and it was basically 'yay, we're getting a train'. I suspect many will be disappointed.
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lenaitch
Senior Member
Your use of the term "built-up area" is creative. Again, those populations are for the amalgamated municipalities (mostly amalgamated during the Harris government). Tweed (proper) and Sharbot Lake are both around 1500; although admittedly, the larger municipalities would be catchment.
Unless the goal is to provide a local travel option, or to turn one or more of these into an urban bedroom community, I'm not sure a multi-billion service to connect existing urban areas should include all the burgs along the line.
I've seen no mention of mixing high-speed and regular service, although there might be.
ShonTron
Moderator
Again, there’s definitely the possibility of local stops on a high speed rail corridor. You merely need to build stopping tracks off the mainline and/or schedule trains properly that you have a local train slotted far ahead of an express that there’s no interference. This is how it is done in Japan, for instance.
I might expect a stop in Smiths Falls and/or Perth, but probably nothing else east of Peterborough because of the low density.
As for the Canadian Shield, that’s hardly a barrier for modern rail or highway construction. Dynamite is your friend.
I might expect a stop in Smiths Falls and/or Perth, but probably nothing else east of Peterborough because of the low density.
As for the Canadian Shield, that’s hardly a barrier for modern rail or highway construction. Dynamite is your friend.
crs1026
Superstar
Do not discount politics. Having said that, stopping a single train a day in Kaladar or Sydenham does not really impact the overall value proposition and may be operationally benign.
There will be pluses and minuses. HSR is much more tolerant of gradient, but less tolerant of curvature. Blasting is easy (sort of) but crossing swamps or lakes that may represent a long way down to bedrock are another matter. Maybe some short tunnels but also some elevated guideways.
- Paul
micheal_can
Senior Member
A 1 a day regular passenger train along the route may be enough to placate those 'built up' areas. None are large enough to warrant anything more.They are too far from Ottawa and Toronto to make them bedroom communities. I listed them so that we can have an honest look at what is along the route. Having said that, the fact that these towns are pushing for something does further support my thinking that there should be an expansion of passenger rail in Canada. So, hopefully, something reasonable is done.
MisterF
Senior Member
Perth and Havelock are both not on the Canadian Shield. The part of the Alto route that goes through the Shield is shorter than most people on here think.
p_xavier
Active Member
My town will triple in population in 4 years so it would def be a way to urbanize rural areas.
nfitz
Superstar
I'd have thought with far few road crossing than in farm country, and with dynamite being a LOT cheaper than bridges (especially on O&M), that the last thing you'd do, if you were using the Peterborough alignment it to try and skirt around the shield! Once they went from HFR to HST, most of my objections to using the old CP alignment went away as so many of the problem areas essentially become greenfields (or perhaps green rock outcrops
).