[Frankietls]

From a passenger POV I prefer chest-height PEDs, make the platform significantly less clautrophobic. In Asia they started with this types in the early days before switching to complete full height PEDs in new built stations partly because it helps saving a lot of AC running cost, and their summers are getting hotter and longer year by year.

 

[DSCToronto]

From a passenger POV I prefer chest-height PEDs, make the platform significantly less clautrophobic. In Asia they started with this types in the early days before switching to complete full height PEDs in new built stations partly because it helps saving a lot of AC running cost, and their summers are getting hotter and longer year by year.

Yes, full height ones are clearly 'best' but maybe only for NEW stations. Question: Which type are 'we' planning for??

 

[Northern Light]

Yes, full height ones are clearly 'best' but maybe only for NEW stations. Question: Which type are 'we' planning for??

The proposed budget of 50M per station is suggestive of full-height to me.

Though the report the TTC commissioned suggested 4 different variations and trying out each in at least one station to see how they worked.

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

This video is from 2 years ago about barriers on New York City subway being installed...

 

[urbanclient]

^From an old post, PSDs like these could be done if the side platform is wide enough, or for centre platforms. I reckon this would not necessitate ATC. Would also avoid the issue of the platform edges being too weak to support the weight.

 

[DSCToronto]

The proposed budget of 50M per station is suggestive of full-height to me.

Though the report the TTC commissioned suggested 4 different variations and trying out each in at least one station to see how they worked.

Seems overkill to have full height to me - it might be the Gold Standard but we really have other needs too.

 

[APTA-2048]

View attachment 739518

^From an old post, PSDs like these could be done if the side platform is wide enough, or for centre platforms. I reckon this would not necessitate ATC. Would also avoid the issue of the platform edges being too weak to support the weight.

Would be hard at some stations with centre platforms. It’s already pretty narrow next to the stairways.

 

[Northern Light]

Seems overkill to have full height to me - it might be the Gold Standard but we really have other needs too.

I think that depends on how effective 1/2 height is at achieving the desired goal. I'm open minded on the point.

Lets see what the research tells us:

In the details, we find that 1/2 height doors are 60-80% as effective at suicide prevention. So let's split the difference and call it 70%.

Is that good enough? Does the effectiveness rate in terms of suicide prevention compare with general trespass rates? Less clear to me in terms of a study or report, but I'd be inclined to think it was similar, or a bit lower.

There are full height options that don't eliminate all tunnel-based ventilation. (wire mesh is used over ~6ft in height.)

 

[M II A II R II K]

The TYSSE stations platform doors obviously won’t go up to the ceiling so there would have to be some rod that the top would have to attach to.

 

[reinventingthewheel]

The TYSSE stations platform doors obviously won’t go up to the ceiling so there would have to be some rod that the top would have to attach to.

None are busy enough to warrant the upgrade for a long time. Their platforms are much more spacious than many of the downtown ones too.

 

[Amare]

View attachment 739430

Yeah....good luck to them on this project. Knowing what goes on in this city, this will turn out exactly like the station modernization project from ~20 years ago.

A nice beautiful list of stations, which will get whittled down to 3-4, which will then get cheapened, and will end up never being talked about again.

Apologies for the pessimism, but we will never see full PED rollout in this city. We'll be lucky if it's done at even 5 stations. I'll take a wager and say that Bloor-Yonge, St.George, and 2 other random stations will see full PED. After that, this project will be put on ice.

 

[Northern Light]

Yeah....good luck to them on this project. Knowing what goes on in this city, this will turn out exactly like the station modernization project from ~20 years ago.

A nice beautiful list of stations, which will get whittled down to 3-4, which will then get cheapened, and will end up never being talked about again.

Apologies for the pessimism, but we will never see full PED rollout in this city. We'll be lucky if it's done at even 5 stations. I'll take a wager and say that Bloor-Yonge, St.George, and 2 other random stations will see full PED. After that, this project will be put on ice.

A certain cynicism is healthy, one might catastrophically depressed otherwise; however, I choose to err a bit the other way, if I didn't think I could make a positive difference, I'd stop trying; something I don't want.

I'm not sure we'll see full rollout in my life time, nor am I sure we need to; I think a focus on problem stations can achieve a lot.

With respect to suicides, there is a known link between speed of entry of trains and blind approaches. If an operator can see someone at the platform edge, particularly near their point of entry, they can slow down, which reduces the likelihood of an unfortunate choice.

Trespassing has other associations.

Get the 12-15 most problematic stations, and solve 75% of the problem. I'm not opposed to a full rollout, but an outcome well short of that could be very worthwhile.

I will say this, this is a file I've spent time on, by no means am I the only one or claiming any inordinate credit; but I have repeatedly raised the issue, and been involved in countering every setback.

I'm happy to see this come forward again, and I will push hard until I see meaningful progress.

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

If only the TTC used the overhead ceiling for ropes...

 

[turini2]

I think that depends on how effective 1/2 height is at achieving the desired goal. I'm open minded on the point.

Lets see what the research tells us: In the details, we find that 1/2 height doors are 60-80% as effective at suicide prevention. So let's split the difference and call it 70%.

Is that good enough? Does the effectiveness rate in terms of suicide prevention compare with general trespass rates? Less clear to me in terms of a study or report, but I'd be inclined to think it was similar, or a bit lower.

There are full height options that don't eliminate all tunnel-based ventilation. (wire mesh is used over ~6ft in height.)

Paris installed half height porte paliere doors when automating Line 1, but installed 3/4 height doors on Line 4's automation, as they still had issues with people climbing over/throwing litter. The same height doors will be used on Line 13's upcoming automation.