Undead
Senior Member
Scope creep is a thing.
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Bureaucromancer
Active Member
Thats literally how going to 7 instead of stopping at York U was framed
rbt
Senior Member
Not if you like Wonderland. Wonderland as an entertainment company is worth maybe $1.5B.
Wonderland as land for redevelopment similar to the area around VMC is worth around $5B (330 acres, ~$15M/acre). They could completely rebuild Wonderland north of Barrie for $2B and pocket the remainder.
Woodbridge_Heights
Senior Member
ayl5402
New Member
Midtown line proposal?
micheal_can
Senior Member
If we did extensions so that the line would not need to be extended for decades, if ever, then it is not scope creep.It is future proofing.
north-of-anything
Active Member
I like the Warren Park station; it's a good place for a future Jane line and a St. Clair extension to converge.
No way would Dufferin get passed over for a station in favour of Dovercourt, though. Symington only really makes sense if it also serves as a transfer to Barrie GO, which probably won't happen as it's too close to Bloor. Bathurst is also a little questionable, given the proximity to Dupont on Line 1 and the lack of streetcar revenue service on Bathurst there. I think Bathurst would be better served by shifting the Dupont platforms west of the Line 1 station.
The Midtown line would also need to be longer. Kipling to Summerhill doesn't actually relieve anything. At a minimum, it needs to go beyond Warden/Ellesmere in the east and enter Mississauga in the west.
Undead
Senior Member
Opportunity cost is also a major issue that I alluded to in my previous post. Why must we keep rehashing this?
micheal_can
Senior Member
As I see it, there are lots of excuses we all make for why transit is so horrible. Not building enough in one contract is one of them. That is a loss of opportunity.
Woodbridge_Heights
Senior Member
Extending to VMills/Canada's Wonderland is patently absurd. There simply isn't enough density there to support a subway, nor will there be the type of intensification we are seeing at VMC.
Are VMills and Canada's Wonderland trip generators? Sure, but
- There's malls connected to line 1 (Yorkdale and Eaton Centre) that offer the same selection as Vmills (save for Bass Pro). No one is going to take the subway from Toronto to VMills, in fact I think the VMills shuttle bus from Yorkdale station has been cancelled. And from my own anecdotal experience VMills customers tend to come from the ex-urbs surrounding the GTA and not from the urban core. And when you think about it for anyone living between Vaughan and Barrie West of the 400 this is the main option for a mall. Finally one look at the parking lot will tell you that the mall caters to car drivers not public transit commuters.
- Canada's Wonderland is very popular and a massive trip generator, but also is seasonal. They have tried to be a 4 seasons attraction with Halloween haunt and the Christmas walks, but it's a summer attraction that is much much less busy during the winter months. In this scenario the best option is to run busses that can be added or removed to coincide with busy periods.
- If you are putting a stop at Wonderland, you may as well put another stop at Cortelucci hospital as well, it's only a few hundred m from Wonderlands' front gate to Cortelucci. Then what? The Walmart distribution centre? There's hundreds of people who work there.
Honestly for the same money we'd be better off building some BRT lines along Jane from Cortellucci to VMC, on Keele from Maple Go to VMC and on Weston from Teston to VMC
Are VMills and Canada's Wonderland trip generators? Sure, but
- There's malls connected to line 1 (Yorkdale and Eaton Centre) that offer the same selection as Vmills (save for Bass Pro). No one is going to take the subway from Toronto to VMills, in fact I think the VMills shuttle bus from Yorkdale station has been cancelled. And from my own anecdotal experience VMills customers tend to come from the ex-urbs surrounding the GTA and not from the urban core. And when you think about it for anyone living between Vaughan and Barrie West of the 400 this is the main option for a mall. Finally one look at the parking lot will tell you that the mall caters to car drivers not public transit commuters.
- Canada's Wonderland is very popular and a massive trip generator, but also is seasonal. They have tried to be a 4 seasons attraction with Halloween haunt and the Christmas walks, but it's a summer attraction that is much much less busy during the winter months. In this scenario the best option is to run busses that can be added or removed to coincide with busy periods.
- If you are putting a stop at Wonderland, you may as well put another stop at Cortelucci hospital as well, it's only a few hundred m from Wonderlands' front gate to Cortelucci. Then what? The Walmart distribution centre? There's hundreds of people who work there.
Honestly for the same money we'd be better off building some BRT lines along Jane from Cortellucci to VMC, on Keele from Maple Go to VMC and on Weston from Teston to VMC
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