Waiting for the day when developers realize a tiny ass two bedroom unit does not need two full sized bathrooms.
 
Remember that any stock you're seeing close to coming online now is reflective of market sentiment as much as 4-5 years ago at this point. Many developers in the city have (finally) come around to understanding that the market became way too oversaturated with tiny units and are now scrambling towards larger units.

The latest market data also proves out a shift in consumer demand; per Bullpen, the recent drop in average rent was by far most significant un units <500sf. Rents in those smaller suites dropped over the last two years by 7%, compared against a 4% drop in 600sf units and just a 3% drop in 700sf units.
 
DavidCapizzano said:
Waiting for the day when developers realize a tiny ass two bedroom unit does not need two full sized bathrooms.
Click to expand...

The two bedroom, of course, should not be 'tiny assed'.

The reasoning in 2 full baths btw, goes like this...........An en suite for a master bedroom is generally expected (and if you have two or more bedrooms one will typically be marketed as the master.)

That bathroom, typically, is only accessible from within the master bedroom.

It would be thought of as interfering with privacy if anyone (most often a child) needed to tromp through mom and dad's bedroom to take a shower/bath. (or dye hair etc.)

So where a 1bdrm will often get 1.5 baths (an en suite and a 1/2 bath), multi-bedrooms tend to get 2 full bath.

The perceived alternative would that the full bath is accessible from the hall, but many people don't like that.

I'd be surprised to see this change, particularly in a market with fall prices, and where the smallest units are facing the greatest price pressure.
 
Northern Light said:
The two bedroom, of course, should not be 'tiny assed'.

The reasoning in 2 full baths btw, goes like this...........An en suite for a master bedroom is generally expected (and if you have two or more bedrooms one will typically be marketed as the master.)

That bathroom, typically, is only accessible from within the master bedroom.

It would be thought of as interfering with privacy if anyone (most often a child) needed to tromp through mom and dad's bedroom to take a shower/bath. (or dye hair etc.)

So where a 1bdrm will often get 1.5 baths (an en suite and a 1/2 bath), multi-bedrooms tend to get 2 full bath.

The perceived alternative would that the full bath is accessible from the hall, but many people don't like that.

I'd be surprised to see this change, particularly in a market with fall prices, and where the smallest units are facing the greatest price pressure.
Click to expand...

This wasn't really an invitation for discussion but thanks anyways
 
unrealestate said:
Tokyo, NY, London, any big city. For some reason its appalling here
Click to expand...
People in NA have this crazy obsession with personal space and its allocation, and there's definitely an expectation of living with space. Anyone who has been to a majorly dense city knows how little space is afforded to them in public and how a micro apartment in some of these places is quite nice by comparison. We are, after all, the people of the McMansion.
 
Hamiltonian said:
Micro unit in tokyo = 🥰
Micro unit in toronto = :mad:
Click to expand...
unrealestate said:
Tokyo, NY, London, any big city. For some reason its appalling here
Click to expand...
Mihairokov said:
People in NA have this crazy obsession with personal space and its allocation, and there's definitely an expectation of living with space. Anyone who has been to a majorly dense city knows how little space is afforded to them in public and how a micro apartment in some of these places is quite nice by comparison. We are, after all, the people of the McMansion.
Click to expand...
Post equivalent plans if they're so similar. As a side note, some local architectural firms regularly undersize / scale down furniture so it looks better than it will be once constructed.
 
ProjectEnd said:
Post equivalent plans if they're so similar
Click to expand...
Ok. Here's a 40 sq/m apartment in Minato-ku for $2,700 CAD/month.

www.kencorp.com

Livio Residence Nishi-azabu for rent | Tokyo Apartments - Ken Corporation Ltd.

Livio Residence Nishi-azabu for rent,Tokyo apartment and house rental listings and information especially for expatriates, provided by Ken Corporation Ltd. More than 3,000 listings include luxury house for executives, high-rise apartment like Roppongi Hills, and various type of properties in...
www.kencorp.com

2023110207_a.gif

Took me like two seconds on google.

Anyway, I didn't say anything about them being similar; just that Canadians (and Americans) have this fascination with having a ton of personal space at home that they don't really need or use. Just extra storage space for all their consumerist stuff.
 
Mihairokov said:
Ok. Here's a 40 sq/m apartment in Minato-ku for $2,700 CAD/month.

www.kencorp.com

Livio Residence Nishi-azabu for rent | Tokyo Apartments - Ken Corporation Ltd.

Livio Residence Nishi-azabu for rent,Tokyo apartment and house rental listings and information especially for expatriates, provided by Ken Corporation Ltd. More than 3,000 listings include luxury house for executives, high-rise apartment like Roppongi Hills, and various type of properties in...
www.kencorp.com

2023110207_a.gif

Took me like two seconds on google.

Anyway, I didn't say anything about them being similar; just that Canadians (and Americans) have this fascination with having a ton of personal space at home that they don't really need or use. Just extra storage space for all their consumerist stuff.
Click to expand...

2700 a month to live in one of the most vibrant and exciting cities on the planet, or 2700 a month to rent from an absentee investor slumlord in Toronto 🥴
 
Mihairokov said:
People in NA have this crazy obsession with personal space and its allocation, and there's definitely an expectation of living with space. Anyone who has been to a majorly dense city knows how little space is afforded to them in public and how a micro apartment in some of these places is quite nice by comparison. We are, after all, the people of the McMansion.
Click to expand...

I disagree.

I find Tokyo and even London, claustrophobic, I don't see that as my problem of skewed perception, but theirs.

Frankly, I oppose the existence of urban centres of 20,000,000 (region) for just this reason. It sets off unreasonable real estate values and commute times the solution to which is ever more 'micro' living which is expensive, and unpleasant.

When you have a 1/2 fridge, and no spare bedroom and zero closet space and no parking, you don't have a utopian life..........you have misery for most people.

Because in Paris and in Tokyo the majority of households own a car, and now they have to pay to park it, typically several blocks away, they have 'stuff' which doesn't fit in their apartment, so they have to rent off-site storage for more money, and they can't buy anything in bulk, or even take advantage of a good grocery sale, so their daily goods costs are higher and they eat out more and even great expense.

Add that up to the tension of living in a very tight space and the unaffordability of starting a family and you see a plummeting birth rate.

I say all this as someone who helped abolish parking minimums, owns a car but takes transit far more frequently than I drive, has over 1,000ft2 to myself, but still shops for food 3x weekly because I enjoy it.....and doesn't have kids.

But I find the idea of living in a tiny box abhorrent. I enjoy camping, and my gear takes up 40ft2 (2 tents, 3 sleeping bags, a cooler, a drink cooler, 2 air mattresses, etc.) I have sporting goods, badminton rackets and birdies, tennis rackets and balls,
I have seasonal decorations (Christmas Tree, lights, stockings, etc.), I have a tool box, a drill, landscaping equipment (pruners, shears, trowels, shovels, saws etc.). Lots of other stuff too.

I have a wardrobe of clothes I actually wear, 1/2 a dozen towels, room to store the large package of TP when it goes on sale, first aid supplies, toiletries etc.

I have a spare box of my engineered hardwood flooring, a booster pack for my car battery, spare paint cans of my custom wall colours.

One of my bedrooms is my home office, which I actually work from and am typing in right now; while another is a spare for company.

****

Here's the thing, all my friends call me a minimalist.

I like space around my furniture, and clear walking paths. I don't store stuff in public view, my walls have art, but its featured, not clutter.

If you want to live in 400ft2, I certainly wouldn't stop you; but if you want to insist others live in it cheerfully, I will strenuously object.
 
Last edited:
Mihairokov said:
Ok. Here's a 40 sq/m apartment in Minato-ku for $2,700 CAD/month.

www.kencorp.com

Livio Residence Nishi-azabu for rent | Tokyo Apartments - Ken Corporation Ltd.

Livio Residence Nishi-azabu for rent,Tokyo apartment and house rental listings and information especially for expatriates, provided by Ken Corporation Ltd. More than 3,000 listings include luxury house for executives, high-rise apartment like Roppongi Hills, and various type of properties in...
www.kencorp.com

Took me like two seconds on google.

Anyway, I didn't say anything about them being similar; just that Canadians (and Americans) have this fascination with having a ton of personal space at home that they don't really need or use. Just extra storage space for all their consumerist stuff.
Click to expand...
If you think this apartment:
2023110207_a.gif

and this apartment:
img_8148-jpeg.678438

Represent a similar quality of space, never mind the fact that Tokyo and Toronto aren't even breathing the same air in terms of quality of broader urban environment, then I don't know what to tell you.
 
Northern Light said:
I disagree.

I find Tokyo and even London, claustrophobic, I don't see that as my problem of skewed perception, but theirs.

Frankly, I oppose the existence of urban centres of 20,000,000 (region) for just this reason. It sets off unreasonable real estate values and commute times the solution to which is every more 'micro' living which is expensive, and unpleasant.

When you have a 1/2 fridge, and no spare bedroom and zero closet space and no parking, you don't have a utopian life..........you have misery for most people.

Because in Paris and in Tokyo the majority of households own a car, and now they have to pay to park it, typically several blocks away, they have 'stuff' which doesn't fit in their apartment, so they have to rent off-site storage for more money, and they can't buy anything in bulk, or even take advantage of a good grocery sale, so their daily goods costs are higher and they eat out more and even great expense.

Add that up to the tension of living in a very tight space and the unaffordability of starting a family and you see a plummeting birth rate.

I say all this as someone who helped abolish parking minimums, owns a car but takes transit far more frequently than I drive, has over 1,000ft2 to myself, but still shops for food 3x weekly because I enjoy it.....and doesn't have kids.

But I find the idea of living in a tiny box abhorrent. I enjoy camping, and my gear takes up 40ft2 (2 tents, 3 sleeping bags, a cooler, a drink cooler, 2 air mattresses, etc.) I have sporting goods, badminton rackets and birdies, tennis rackets and balls,
I have seasonal decorations (Christmas Tree, lights, stockings, etc.), I have a tool box, a drill, landscaping equipment (pruners, shears, trowels, shovels, saws etc.). Lots of other stuff too.

I have a wardrobe of clothes I actually wear, 1/2 a dozen towels, room to store the large package of TP when it goes on sale, first aid supplies, toiletries etc.

I have a spare box of my engineered hardwood flooring, a booster pack for my car battery, spare paint cans of my custom wall colours.

One of my bedrooms is my home office, which I actually work from and typing in right now; while another is a spare for company.

****

Here's the thing, all my friends call me a minimalist.

I like space around my furniture, and clear walking paths. I don't store stuff in public view, my walls have art, but its featured, not clutter.

If you want to live in 400ft2, I certainly wouldn't stop you; but if you want to insist others live in it cheerfully, I'll will strenuously object.
Click to expand...
Too bad that you oppose urban centres with 20M people, but they exist and people want to live in them. They are the most interesting places in the world that attract the most tourists. If each person gets 1000+sqft you end up with never ending sprawl
 
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