So thinking about this. Its not public exactly how much they paid these guys, but in terms of actual ownership is it possible they had a case that they actually owned it?

What if they were paid like 100 million?
Past reporting said MX paid CN 79 million for the air rights?
 
generalcanada said:
So thinking about this. Its not public exactly how much they paid these guys, but in terms of actual ownership is it possible they had a case that they actually owned it?

What if they were paid like 100 million?
Past reporting said MX paid CN 79 million for the air rights?
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They were likely paid a fraction of that. The claim was pretty tenuous and settlements are usually nowhere close to the original claim amount which is purposefully inflated.
 
The claim was for $500M on an agreement for Craft to purchase at $78M, not even a completed purchase. Metrolinx paid the railways based on that same valuation. The only settlement payment to Craft should be a swift kick in the bollocks, but of course they are in bed with Doug Ford.
 
reinventingthewheel said:
The claim was for $500M on an agreement for Craft to purchase at $78M, not even a completed purchase. Metrolinx paid the railways based on that same valuation. The only settlement payment to Craft should be a swift kick in the bollocks, but of course they are in bed with Doug Ford.
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well but to be clear, Craft did apperently pay CN for the air rights fully as per trillium reporting. I dont know how that works because MX paid CN too, but id highly suspect its not the full 500 million.
 
reinventingthewheel said:
The claim was for $500M on an agreement for Craft to purchase at $78M, not even a completed purchase. Metrolinx paid the railways based on that same valuation. The only settlement payment to Craft should be a swift kick in the bollocks, but of course they are in bed with Doug Ford.
Click to expand...
For all we know they settled on a payment of $10.

Obviously not - it's probably a couple million at least - but I'm sure it's decided in the courts on what a fair payment for it actually is. How much depends on how much Craft managed to convince the courts they could have actually developed the lands, most likely.
 
I feel this is bit of a mute point now as neither parties (The City or private interests) are in the position to build anything over the tracks at this stage.
 
innsertnamehere said:
For all we know they settled on a payment of $10.

Obviously not - it's probably a couple million at least - but I'm sure it's decided in the courts on what a fair payment for it actually is. How much depends on how much Craft managed to convince the courts they could have actually developed the lands, most likely.
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If the courts had any wherewithal, they'd recognize that Craft's ability to develop those sections was / is precisely: dick all.
 
ProjectEnd said:
If the courts had any wherewithal, they'd recognize that Craft's ability to develop those sections was / is precisely: dick all.
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Thats not the point, Craft owned it yes, so theyre owed at least what they paid for it to CN. thats 80 million. Weirdly MX paid CN that amount too.

But Craft claims its worth more because of "potential". If they still owned the land in 10 15 years, would it still be impossible to build? Thats expropriation law for you. Its about "future value". not just todays value
 
generalcanada said:
Thats not the point, Craft owned it yes, so theyre owed at least what they paid for it to CN. thats 80 million. Weirdly MX paid CN that amount too.

But Craft claims its worth more because of "potential". If they still owned the land in 10 15 years, would it still be impossible to build? Thats expropriation law for you. Its about "future value". not just todays value
Click to expand...
Yes.
 
generalcanada said:
Thats not the point, Craft owned it yes, so theyre owed at least what they paid for it to CN. thats 80 million. Weirdly MX paid CN that amount too.
Click to expand...
You’re really fudging the details.
  • 2018: Craft obtains agreement in principle to purchase air rights, not a contract nor a payment.
  • 2021-22: Metrolinx expropriates air rights and pays owner based on previous valuation presented to Craft
  • Had Craft paid any money it would be owed to them by the previous owners, not Metrolinx
generalcanada said:
If they still owned the land in 10 15 years, would it still be impossible to build?
Click to expand...
  • Metrolinx lawyers describe the air right properties as “extremely difficult, if not impossible” to construct towers on
  • Since they are just air rights, it is physically impossible to access without also purchasing neighbouring properties for vertical circulation
When Metrolinx originally acquired the railways it was perhaps naive or myopic to leave the air rights with their previous owners, now the expropriation makes clear they don’t want any interference with GO expansion /electrification.
 
Forget the city / province / country's current economic state, the site requirements necessary to get a building platform in place, as well as the necessary property acquisitions around the USRC itself make this entire canard fundamentally impossible. It wasn't going to happen in the halcyon days of 2021, it's not going to happen in the nadir of 2026, and it's not going to happen in the anticipated 'rebound' of, say, 2031. The entire ORCA concept, when first debuted in 2017, was nothing more than a smoke-and-mirrors show to rook gullible rubes into believing that something like that could happen, not a competent, buildable plan for it to happen.
 
lol "Two civil engineering experts said the project would be extraordinarily difficult, but possible — if Craft Kingsmen figured out a way to control the land next to the tracks, which is necessary for foundations that would hold the development up.
“If you don't own land on both sides, you can't. There's no way to do it,” said University of Western Ontario (UWO) civil engineering professor Hesham El Naggar."
 
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