Amare
Senior Member
Well.....looks like we got Toronto'ed.
......again
......again
- Thread starter Northern Light
- Start date
Skyhighzz
Active Member
I’ve seen worse re-workings & re-designs in this city-much worse. It’s not bad. The original design (basically a lie) was so spectacular that the letdown is so bleak. Dream Unlimited … is anything but.
Pinkpigeon
New Member
Hello! (It's my first ever post after lurking for years!) Just to clarify is there no possibility that this new design could be reworked again? Has this been approved by the city or waterfront Toronto for sure?
Skyhighzz
Active Member
They can do anything they want. I didn’t see final design anywhere, so maybe.
Lyphe
Active Member
I agree. Not actually too bad - just nowhere close to what 'was' before.
Northern Light
Superstar
Welcome to the visible side of UT!
As noted by @Skyhighzz above, what you're seeing is a Site Plan Approval Application.
It is not yet approved.
So in terms of process, technically, there is an opportunity to re-work this, somewhat.
However, not much, in reality.
1) This building already has money attached, as in a specific number approved by multiple governments, any major changes would require budgetary resources and every funder/approver would have to agree.
2) The timing here is dictated by the above process to a great degree, time is money, and a comprehensive re-think, as opposed to just some colour change in the brick or the like, would take considerable time.
3) It would be a lot of time and money to switch architectural firms, and I'm not sold that Teeple is capable of correcting their mistake here, even if they were given the budget and time to do so.
4) Modifications that either add costs directly (the design time + better material choices) or indirectly by cutting height, or softening the building (some have referenced Aqualuna, adding those types of curves would add direct costs, but also take away some ft2 making for fewer or smaller affordable units.
***
Nothing precludes, in an absolute sense, re-working this meaningfully, but there are many things working against it.
That's really unfortunate, because we shouldn't have to as a community choose to accept delay, or less affordable housing to achieve design excellence we were already promised.
***
Final note here, piling all the affordable housing into Queen's Quay buildings is not a good plan. The units should be mixed into the other rental buildings on the site you don't want stigma attached to buildings, or more particularly their residents.
That's the reason you mix income levels behind the same facade.
ProjectEnd
Superstar
The only way this could / would get "reworked" is further cheapening. The Adjaye thing was never going to happen, even in a good market.
Northern Light
Superstar
While I don't disagree, that isn't acceptable and people should lose their jobs for that.
This is a public sector RFP/Design Competition.
Honesty is the bare minimum of expectations.
junctionist
Senior Member
It's unfortunate that Teeple has done such tepid work here. That firm and Saucier and Perotte were my favourite Canadian firms for a while, but now Hariri Pontarini is probably tops.
Start Fox
Active Member
This seems like the crux of the issue to me (a relative layperson). I don't understand the economics, but there seems to be no way this was going to be a show-stopper once it become 100% affordable rental. I think that's why I fall on the side of liking it - in my view, as a 100% affordable rental building it is actually quite impressive. But I don't understand why the affordable rental in Building 1C couldn't have been redistributed into the towers (with increased height - I don't think anyone has issue with maximizing height on this site).
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
I seem to recall the TCHC soured on highrises after their experience with Block 32 at Cityplace - but that's assuming the TCHC will be the operator here.
AoD
UtakataNoAnnex
Senior Member
...yeah, /upvoting this for the adorable avatar here. <3
Pinkpigeon
New Member
Aww, thanks for the warm welcome @UtakataNoAnnex and @Northern Light! (I recently got a new haircut and was told by multiple people I look like the Milky girl, so I thought it'd be fitting...
) As a relative layperson who forgets all the complexities of the city building process, it's really nice to be able to hear the perspectives of everyone here who knows so much! Looking forward to hearing everyone's take on the city developments going forward!
) As a relative layperson who forgets all the complexities of the city building process, it's really nice to be able to hear the perspectives of everyone here who knows so much! Looking forward to hearing everyone's take on the city developments going forward!
GameOnBrad
Active Member
Aww, thanks for the warm welcome @UtakataNoAnnex and @Northern Light! (I recently got a new haircut and was told by multiple people I look like the Milky girl, so I thought it'd be fitting...
Oh, there are many of us here who like the pretty buildings and "Hydraulic Jackhammer? Smash!".
Obsidian
Active Member
it is reworked again it will be to save more money. not to spend more money, this only goes in one direction. So you better hope it will not be reworked again.