CapitalSeven
Senior Member
I don't think it's fair to say those visuals of dozens of buses were "the norm." They happened too often, but 90 percent of the time it operated acceptably during rush hours and with no delays off-peak.
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- Thread starter Reecemartin
- Start date
Kyle Campbell
Senior Member
Off peak was fine, but the afternoon peak I'd disagree with that assessment. No not buses all the way to Lebreton like that picture, but it was slow all the time at least to Mackenzie King most of the time and usually to Laurier as well. It got a bit better after they cut the number of routes that went downtown by half, which they did to my own route. But that was the day that fabled one seat ride went away, and that was years before the train opened. Another logjam was at Hurdman station due to how buses crossed paths at either end. Even the inbound trip was starting to get bad, it was not unusual for me to get off at Mackenzie King and walk the rest of the way to work, it was faster then going to Metcalfe which was my stop
People tend to have a rose tinted glasses when thinking of the Transitway, we remember the speedy rides downtown of the 80s and 90s, which still was okayish near the end, but forget the gongshow trying to get out of downtown on the reverse trip that was steadily getting worse
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Sauga89
Active Member
In winter, the wait times downtown for a bus were long and cold. At least the new underground stations aren't so cold.
Kyle Campbell
Senior Member
The way to put it in context for people in the GTA is that Ottawa was at the same max capacity problem with the Transitway that Toronto is with capacity constraints with the interchange between Line 1 and 2 (pre-covid). Toronto is solving it's problem with the Ontario line and a platform expansion, ours was to switch from bus to rail. There's been a lot of potholes along the way, but eventually the destination will be worth it.
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reaperexpress
Senior Member
I haven't looked up historical schedule for the east-west transitway, but here's the chart including the transitway that still exists (the Southeast Transitway, South Keys to Hurdman). It's faster than any of the comparable subway lines despite having closer than average stop spacing. (Those who've ridden the transitway know how short the dwell times are, so that's not surprising). Ottawa recently reduced the speed limits on the transitway so buses may have been even faster before.
reaperexpress
Senior Member
I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that the destination will be worth it. The status quo is that the City will let the existing lines stagnate with lacklustre ridership and declining frequency (with similar ripple effects on the entire bus network since the O-Train is supposed to be the spine that attracts riders).
We need to continue pushing the City to fix the problems with its existing O-Train lines to get the system to deliver what it promised. That's not a small undertaking since bringing line 2/4 up to rapid transit standards would take hundreds of millions of dollars, and we don't even know if it's possible to fix the speed restrictions on Line 1 at all.
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nfitz
Superstar
I hadn't realised that the current Ottawa issues were so minor. I thought there were significant delays.
Kyle Campbell
Senior Member
The capacity issues were all between Hurdman and Bayview in rush hour. Mostly Albert/Slater, but another issue was the island station at Hurdman. Since buses have doors on only one side, this meant traffic had to cross each other at both ends of the station, causing backups.
The scheduled travel time from Lebreton(now Pimisi) to Blair on the 95 was 25 minutes at 3pm back in the day: https://web.archive.org/web/20030210075440/http://www.octranspo.com/maps_menue.htm
The current travel time from Pimisi to Blair is actually 23 minutes: https://www.octranspo.com/en/plan-your-trip/schedules-maps/
So on paper, the current OTrain is actually faster. But reality is different. The Otrain will take 23 minutes every single time, with almost no variation as the trains are semi-automatic. The 95 could skip stations if nobody was there (common at Train and Cyrville) or it could get stuck in the downtown section. So it was highly variable, it was often 5 or more minutes faster then the posted time, but in rush hour it was usually running 10-15 minutes behind schedule. Also, assuming it was on schedule, Hurdman->Blair was much faster then the O-Train, but Pimisi->Hurdman is much slower, which is why the O-Train turtle vs Transitway rabbit wins that race, because it's moving at a steady pace at all times.
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Kyle Campbell
Senior Member
I'm referring to the dangerous platform crowding on Line 1, which is the main symptom of Line 1 being overcapacity whereas with Ottawa it was delays. Although I'm not sure if this as much a problem now post pandemic.
nfitz
Superstar
I think you are overstating this issue. And where have you seen this on Line 2?
Kyle Campbell
Senior Member
I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree, if you don't consider spending 1.5 billion to increase capacity at Bloor-Yonge and 27 billion on the Ontario line to divert Line 2 riders from that choke point an apt comparison to why is Ottawa spending 7 billion to solve it's Transitway capacity issues.
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nfitz
Superstar
That's driven more by predictions of future demand. And driven by Line 1, not Line 2.
Again - where have you seen this on Line 2?
Kyle Campbell
Senior Member
I've made a minor clarification in the original post where I perhaps was unclear to what I was referring. This discussion on the analogy has run it's course and I won't be posting further replies.
nfitz
Superstar
Oh - you mean at Bloor station.
I've not seen too much issue at Bloor station. Southbound at AM peak used to be the worse - but has it really been as bad since they widened the platforms? The only time I've seen a bit of a problem is when trains weren't coming.
I thought Dundas northbound in PM peak was worse myself - in terms of safety. That project has been delayed too many times.
Abdullah77
New Member
Post-election, has anything been publicly released/said by MTO, Metrolinx, or City of Ottawa about the planned upload of the O-Train to Metrolinx?