[Richard White]

I just spent my $50 GC at the Queen/Yonge/TEC store.

It was very hot. I guess they're going to stiff Toronto Hydro on this

As others have noted, most escalators were not functioning. I didn't check out the elevators.

It was reasonably busy, but no great deals. Still, a new shirt is better than a worthless GC!!!

I was also there this afternoon.

Multiple people complained about the heat. It was sweltering in the store which had me wondering of the HVAC was broken.

The elevators were working. We took them down to the 1st floor when we noticed the escalators were offline. I think only 2 of the 4 were working though.

You said exactly what I said about the sales. They weren't that good. I was looking at kitchen stuff and opted against buying anything when I realised the prices were the same, if not better elsewhere.

The kettles and coffee makers (drip not espresso) were selling between 125 and 400 dollars after discounts which is not justifiable.

 

[PL1]

If I hadn't had a gift card, I probably would not have bought anything. I got a shirt that I can use and paid $5.73 out of pocket.

There were a few bigger discounts, but not on anything I was going to buy.

 

[Brian S-W]

There is no clearance or liquidation sale yet. A few clothing lines like Hudson’s North, and Diesel are on clearance but for the most part the sell-off of merchandise hasn’t begun. In clothing it’s a Spend More, Save More sale, while in Linens and Housewares it’s a Spring Home Book sale. Any better sales can’t start until after tomorrow morning’s court appearance.
The green tags on the fixtures are inventory tags because HBC spent the last two weeks of February doing inventory across the chain for the first time in almost two years.
People are wisely using their gift cards because those might be dead after tomorrow’s 9:00am court hearing. If you still have gift cards Queen Street’s Housewares, Linens, Zellers, and Lindt departments open at 7:30 in the morning for you to shop in person before the gift cards are perhaps rendered valueless.

 

[Jonny5]

Multiple people complained about the heat. It was sweltering in the store which had me wondering of the HVAC was broken.

I'm not saying it's impossible this was the case, but it was suddenly very warm out today, and I know these commercial HVAC systems cannot be quickly changed from heating to cooling, plus we're going back to 0 degrees tonight, so they would be kind of stuck on what to do and probably decided leaving the heat on was the best option as these giant retail spaces take hours to cool down or heat up. You can't simply turn the dial and it's at the new temperature ten minutes later, it takes almost a whole day.

 

[PL1]

I'm not saying it's impossible this was the case, but it was suddenly very warm out today, and I know these commercial HVAC systems cannot be quickly changed from heating to cooling, plus we're going back to 0 degrees tonight, so they would be kind of stuck on what to do and probably decided leaving the heat on was the best option as these giant retail spaces take hours to cool down or heat up. You can't simply turn the dial and it's at the new temperature ten minutes later, it takes almost a whole day.

Good point! I work in a hospital, and concur that it's hard to maintain a normal temperature when the outside temperature is making swings

 

[Amare]

It's such a shame to see what happened to HBC, and it's yet another example of senior management not knowing what they are doing and exasperating the downfall of a company. All these stories about consumer's changing their shopping patterns post pandemic, landlords not giving them rent reductions they were begging for, Canada/U.S politics etc. are really just a smokescreen for the root of the problem.

When you have senior leadership saying things like "I don't know how we're going to get out of this", while simultaneously making stupid business decisions/acquisitions which make absolutely no sense (ie: buying Neiman Marcus for $2+ Billion), that's really where the main problems were. Looking for rent reductions are cute and all but if you make idiotic decisions that no one forces you to do, that's something that's problematic in and of itself.

 

[RGB_11]

It's such a shame to see what happened to HBC, and it's yet another example of senior management not knowing what they are doing and exasperating the downfall of a company. All these stories about consumer's changing their shopping patterns post pandemic, landlords not giving them rent reductions they were begging for, Canada/U.S politics etc. are really just a smokescreen for the root of the problem.

When you have senior leadership saying things like "I don't know how we're going to get out of this", while simultaneously making stupid business decisions/acquisitions which make absolutely no sense (ie: buying Neiman Marcus for $2+ Billion), that's really where the main problems were. Looking for rent reductions are cute and all but if you make idiotic decisions that no one forces you to do, that's something that's problematic in and of itself.

The biggest problem with the Bay is that they kept demanding such high prices for clothing. I only went there to check out what can be found in clearance, often at a good price.
I NEVER paid full price for clothing there. 40% off pants (usually Dockers) wasn't a bad deal though. (the deal came up every now and then...)

 

[Admiral Beez]

The biggest problem with the Bay is that they kept demanding such high prices for clothing.

I call BS on that. I'm annoyed but not surprised by the lazy work of Canadian journalism. The real story about the fall of HBC is its acquisition by PE and VC using HBC as a short term asset to leverage debt against, and using those borrowed monies to pay dividends to the new owners.

How does a four hundred year old company have $724 million in mortgage debt? Here's HBC's financial report from 2001. See below from pg 37. In 2000, HBC owned the land and buildings of 28 HBC/Zellers stores and three DCs. They also owned the Queen/Dundas store and 60% of the land. The second chart below shows that HBC had mortgage INCOME in 2000. The final chart below shows total mortgage debt was $4.8 million (offset by mortgage income of $7.3 million).

So, how does a company that owned most of its real estate outright, with positive mortgage income come to have $724 million in mortgage debt 24 years later? That's the story the financial media should be reporting on - about how US private equity is buying up historic Canadian businesses that employ thousands of Canadians and hold pensions for thousands more, being saddled with junk debt and asset fire sales to finance big payouts and then dumped into bankruptcy. This needs to stop.

 

[RGB_11]

I call BS on that.

Any way you spin it, the store itself was still charging way too much for their clothing. Once people started to realize that you can get the same clothing other places for less money, that makes a good nail in the coffin.

 

[Jonny5]

Any way you spin it, the store itself was still charging way too much for their clothing. Once people started to realize that you can get the same clothing other places for less money, that makes a good nail in the coffin.

Yes, I once went in the store at Queen and Yonge, sometime around 2016, to look for a new professional-looking winter wool coat, the kind that fits over a suit (back in the Before Times when people wore those frequently) and I knew going in there would likely be sticker shock, but I spotted an absolutely gorgeous one, and it was very well made, so I was thinking even if it's a few hundred over budget I will at least consider buying it.

I turned around the price tag to see it was $2,000, marked 10% off LOL.

I simply walked out thinking "this store is not for people like me."

 

[matrix]

Just went to the Yorkdale location. It was bustling on the lower levels, but you can tell the liquidation sales are not quite happening yet. It just looked like normal clearance to me.

They taped the whole Hugo Boss section off here too... But hey, the down escalators were functional. I felt like the luckiest shopper ever for that reason

 

[Richard White]

It's just such a shame. My wife and I had our 1998 wedding registry at the Bay - they had a great Denby section and very good registry service staff. Since then I often bought my shoes from the Bay, raincoats, a sports jacket, and I believe a couch from the Bay. But about ten years ago I stopped going there as the selection was poor and you could never find a staffer to help.

Like I said, you can find better a better selection in the brands own stores than you can in The Bay!

The only time I went in there and bought anything recently was to get a set of bedsheets during Bay Day sales. They were a good price for the quality but otherwise it was not worth it.

Some stuff like Dockers will be a hard find in the near future as I don't believe they are sold elsewhere.

 

[Richard White]

Just went to the Yorkdale location. It was bustling on the lower levels, but you can tell the liquidation sales are not quite happening yet. It just looked like normal clearance to me.

They taped the whole Hugo Boss section off here too... But hey, the down escalators were functional. I felt like the luckiest shopper ever for that reason

View attachment 637392

I wonder if Hugo Boss seized all their merchandise?

 

[RGB_11]

Fair point, but I expect they had to charge higher prices to service the increasingly massive debt load.

On that logic, have one sucker pay $129 for a pair of jeans to service the debt instead of selling Jeans for $88 (or less) and have a percentage of that service the debt, knowing that there would be a lot more customers.
You need customers to make it possible. When the price is too high, it's just a display with nobody buying anything. Nobody buying anything does not service the debt.
Creditors need to be made happy. They are made happy when they see merchandise actually moving off the shelves, not just sitting around...

 

[Richard White]

On that logic, have one sucker pay $129 for a pair of jeans to service the debt instead of selling Jeans for $88 (or less) and have a percentage of that service the debt, knowing that there would be a lot more customers.
You need customers to make it possible. When the price is too high, it's just a display with nobody buying anything. Nobody buying anything does not service the debt.
Creditors need to be made happy. They are made happy when they see merchandise actually moving off the shelves, not just sitting around...

I wonder how much of the pricing has to do with cost price though?

I doubt Hugo Boss is selling their merchandise to the Bay for $50.00. Factor in overheard and other things, that brings you closer to $100.00