[crs1026]

I'm on UP Express right now so staying on topic for this thread it looks like some of the rails have been delivered for the Kitchener Line fourth track at Bloor. The pile of rails are just north of the Bloor Station. I didn't expect to see them so I wasn't able to get a picture. Georgetown South Project memories.

So that's some small positive progress news.

Rode by there today and there was a crew welding and stretching rail between the Bloor Station and the West Toronto underpass.
Won’t amount to anything until the new Randolph pedestrian entrance is opened and track is extended further south, but it’s nice to see this short gap getting filled in - one more bit complete.

- Paul

 

[Allandale25]

^ I had hoped to get over there to take some pictures but I think someone will beat me to it.

 

[Aplus23]

Probably Georgetown South and UPX; one of the rare GO projects where specific service levels were required on opening day.

It looks we as a province can lay track, and even build stations, we've seen elevated tracks get built and bridges widen, why exactly is it so difficult to complete projects. Looks like everything gets peace milled together or done in segments few & far between. Is it a technical issue or incompetence in mgmt issue?

 

[crs1026]

It looks we as a province can lay track, and even build stations, we've seen elevated tracks get built and bridges widen, why exactly is it so difficult to complete projects. Looks like everything gets peace milled together or done in segments few & far between. Is it a technical issue or incompetence in mgmt issue?

Definitely the latter, although I am growing suspicious that money is not flowing and political factors are changing up priorities such that nothing gets worked on for long without being abandoned to meet some other sudden priority, or funding being turned off.

I would count the implementation of hourly off peak service to Mount Pleasant, Aurora, and Unionville as partial wins, but the inability to get to true 2WAD even hourly really detracts from declaring those as accomplishing goals. Quite the reverse, that work has either stalled out or never gained momentum in the first place.

- Paul

 

[Sunnyside]

I think we’ve bitten off more than we can chew.

The need for transport has crescendoed; there would be no choice if we weren’t so good at not doing things, and yet nonetheless...

Knowledge, Labour, Capital, Incompetence- it all looks the same when your stumbling.

 

[smallspy]

Definitely the latter, although I am growing suspicious that money is not flowing and political factors are changing up priorities such that nothing gets worked on for long without being abandoned to meet some other sudden priority, or funding being turned off.

I would count the implementation of hourly off peak service to Mount Pleasant, Aurora, and Unionville as partial wins, but the inability to get to true 2WAD even hourly really detracts from declaring those as accomplishing goals. Quite the reverse, that work has either stalled out or never gained momentum in the first place.

- Paul

While I would agree that it explains why many projects end up only half-completed, it doesn't account for many that have stalled out half-way through the construction - the double-tracking of the Stouffville line being the most famous of this.

In that case, the blame should be laid to rest at Metrolinx's project management capabilities, not with the Government's funding priorities.

Dan

 

[crs1026]

While I would agree that it explains why many projects end up only half-completed, it doesn't account for many that have stalled out half-way through the construction - the double-tracking of the Stouffville line being the most famous of this.

In that case, the blame should be laid to rest at Metrolinx's project management capabilities, not with the Government's funding priorities.

Dan

When I have queried why certain projects stopped moving, the answer was sometimes “(shrug) Budget got cut”
I will admit, it’s not always clear whether that means ML moved the money, or the province took it away or redirected. But either way, it creates a need to return to the well for new money before work can resume.
I am retaining my suspicion that the money is being doled out much more sparingly than the commitment to GO Expansion as an all-in package might imply.
We spectators should pay far closer attention to whether funding has actually been released for each sub-project we are waiting for.


- Paul

 

[goodcitywhenfinished]

I am beginning to think that the better strategy would have been to just put all resources into turning the inner segments of Lakeshore E/W into electrified 2WAD service, and buy some nice Stadler Kiss EMUs to operate the line.

I think if the general public had just one electrified, 5min peak, 15min 2WAD service that was 100% completed to utilize and take example from, we would have way more political expediency in upgrading every other line as quickly as possible.

Not only that, but we would have a project to learn construction/operational efficiencies from, build managerial competencies, and learn best practices to carry forward to the next line conversion.

Instead we will be left with a mish-mash of lines all at various stages of work well into the 2030s.

 

[hw621]

I am beginning to think that the better strategy would have been to just put all resources into turning the inner segments of Lakeshore E/W into electrified 2WAD service, and buy some nice Stadler Kiss EMUs to operate the line.

I think if the general public had just one electrified, 5min peak, 15min 2WAD service that was 100% completed to utilize and take example from, we would have way more political expediency in upgrading every other line as quickly as possible.

Not only that, but we would have a project to learn construction/operational efficiencies from, build managerial competencies, and learn best practices to carry forward to the next line conversion.

Instead we will be left with a mish-mash of lines all at various stages of work well into the 2030s.

I am under the impression that the Province/Metrolinx is dragging their feet on the prep works forever to avoid the actual electrification...

 

[WB62]

There are enough sidings on the RH line to run one counter-peak train. In fact, pre-pandemic GO did operate a counter-peak run from Richmond Hill in the PM peak, albeit out of service just for the sake of getting another trip in the peak direction.

The other part of the limitation is that the counter-peak train needs to sit in each siding waiting for the next peak-direction train to pass by, so travel times are very long. Probably why they didn't run the counter peak trip in service when it did exist.

They still run a train back to Union in the PM, it only takes 50 minutes:

 

[max]

They still run a train back to Union in the PM, it only takes 50 minutes:

View attachment 654665

Just curious where this info comes from and if it's a public document?

 

[smallspy]

They still run a train back to Union in the PM, it only takes 50 minutes:

View attachment 654665

It's easy to do it in 50 minutes with no opposing traffic.

That's why back in the "old days", the afternoon deadheads were scheduled for an hour and a half.

Dan

 

[Thaboss]

I am beginning to think that the better strategy would have been to just put all resources into turning the inner segments of Lakeshore E/W into electrified 2WAD service, and buy some nice Stadler Kiss EMUs to operate the line.

I think if the general public had just one electrified, 5min peak, 15min 2WAD service that was 100% completed to utilize and take example from, we would have way more political expediency in upgrading every other line as quickly as possible.

Not only that, but we would have a project to learn construction/operational efficiencies from, build managerial competencies, and learn best practices to carry forward to the next line conversion.

Instead we will be left with a mish-mash of lines all at various stages of work well into the 2030s.

Absolutly agree. 99 percent of the time, when the public experiences something that good, it'll only be a matter of time before they say....well why not improve it here and here. Politics will shift priorities accordingly.

Right now 99.99 percent of the public couldn't even imagine what 2way electrification is nor could they tell you that it's in active planning.

This is partially why so many are against scope creep. You try to do everything so nothing gets done.

On a somwhat off-topic point. It's why I think ALTOS sucess hinges on completing a much shorter ottawa to montreal stretch, before working on the much longer ottawa toronto stretch.

Ppl need to see it to understand it and to believe it cause then they'll want it !

 

[Metroscapes]

I don't have pictures, but track segments have appeared along the Kitchener line through Guelph. Many are stacked up east of Edinburgh, and west of Alma. I'm really hoping they're finally building the second track, but then again, there's been huge piles of ballast sitting for months without use, and the second platform at Guelph Central Station has been disconnected for some time.

 

[cplchanb]

I don't have pictures, but track segments have appeared along the Kitchener line through Guelph. Many are stacked up east of Edinburgh, and west of Alma. I'm really hoping they're finally building the second track, but then again, there's been huge piles of ballast sitting for months without use, and the second platform at Guelph Central Station has been disconnected for some time.

likewise the stoufville line has so many ties and rail sections piled up ready to lay yet no movement from crews. they did schedule in weekend shutdowns of the line coming up. hopefully that means theyll actually do some rail install instead of sitting on their hands indefinitely.