[crs1026]

@Allandale25 posted this clip of the Mx Board Meeting elsewhere:


1) Caledonia Station (Barrie GO) on target to start construction by year's end, with an in-service date of 3-4 years given.

Good to see this actually out to tender, as it was announced quite a while ago now.

2) Maple GO targeted for full-return of normal operations by Spring' 25

Normal operations meaning, the original main track platform restored to full operability, but..... what about the second platform and track that's new? Nothing said about progress towards double tracking the line.

3) For Stouffville GO Line, there will be a major closure in July (this month) to upgrade signals at 5 at-grade crossings.

Which again does not mean any new track has been placed in service.

New track near McNicoll has been commissioned.

This removed a diversion that was needed during construction of the two-platform layout at Milliken. So now the original platform and first track at Milliken is fully operational in its final alignment.....and the second platform has track.....but.....without the bridge at West Highland Creek, the second track remains inoperable, as are the second platforms at both Milliken and Agincourt.

There was a rather vague statement about a third and final commissioning phase for tracks works 'in the southern area, close to Scarborough Junction' (his words). That would be 'later this year'.

Possibly completing the crossovers at Progress Road that will allow the (built but long sitting idle) second track from there south to Kennedy to finally go into action. Last time I looked, there was absolutely no construction between Kennedy and Scarborough Jct.... that will be single track for a while yet.

In summary, while there is lots of construction happening out there, this is mostly stuff that's off critical path. Nice that it's all getting done but nothing to declare victory over just yet.

- Paul

 

[ARG1]

Just saw this render of Caledonia Station

Please tell me they're not going to build this is a single platform station...

 

[SaugeenJunction]

Just saw this render of Caledonia Station
View attachment 577266

Please tell me they're not going to build this is a single platform station...

Yup, we've seen these renderings before. And yes, Phase 1 is a single platform. A future Phase 2 will see Platform 2 built, along with the pedestrian bridge over the Barrie Line.

 

[crs1026]

Just saw this render of Caledonia Station


Please tell me they're not going to build this is a single platform station...

The original TPAP called for sufficient property acquisition to handle three tracks but only two at platform. The TPAP also notes that the Eglinton bridge would have to be widened to accommodate the third track, and that's not in scope as yet.

- Paul

 

[drum118]

Just saw this render of Caledonia Station
View attachment 577266

Please tell me they're not going to build this is a single platform station...

The rendering I have seen shows a walkway over the corridor that connects to the street and a east platform.

This rendering is wrong as it show cars dropping riders off or been pickup since it is only for TTC buses now in place of the bus loop on the east side of the Barrie line.

Unless things have change in the last few months, the corridor south of Eglinton was graded for a 2nd track, but nothing for the north side. Its possible that the east platform could be a centre platform in place of a side one.

 

[Northern Light]

The video I linked to clearly states that initial configuration will be a single platform on the west side, though they do intend to future proof for something larger.

 

[Chris R.]

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[ARG1]

The video I linked to clearly states that initial configuration will be a single platform on the west side, though they do intend to future proof for something larger.

My question is why? We are already double tracking the Barrie Line with side platforms, and according to the information this will take 4 years to build (so earliest finish late 2028). The explanation by @crs1026 implies that they're thinking of triple tracking the station, which would be somewhat understandable, however the Architectural plans, available as part of the development application available on Toronto's Website (dated December 1st 2023) shows a double track station with no room left for an express track:

So, something's not adding up here.

Link Available: https://www.toronto.ca/city-governm...=5201677&pid=696234&title=2322-EGLINTON-AVE-W
(You may need to refresh cache {ctrl+shift+r} in order to load)

 

[crs1026]

My question is why? We are already double tracking the Barrie Line with side platforms, and according to the information this will take 4 years to build (so earliest finish late 2028). The explanation by @crs1026 implies that they're thinking of triple tracking the station, which would be somewhat understandable, however the Architectural plans, available as part of the development application available on Toronto's Website (dated December 1st 2023) shows a double track station with no room left for an express track:

It's always risky to take renderings too literally (although sometimes they reveal important details that no one has talked about) - but -

First, I reported what was approved in the TPAP, ie two station tracks and one "express" track. The TPAP is now almost a decade old. There have been various iterations to the plan since then, and so the TPAP is somewhat ancient history - except that, having gotten EA approval, it will be easier to proceed all the way to triple track if that is ever actually needed. But the best answer at the moment is - while parts of the corridor including Caledonia GO could possibly be built out to three tracks some day, and ML's construction includes futureproofing towards that, it's pretty clear that ML is not proceeding to that for the immediate future..

Second - has ML abandoned double track? If so, they aren't saying.... despite having repeatedly declared they are double tracking all the way to Maple at least. The roadbed segment south of Caledonia GO (ie the flyover, and northwards from it to just south of Eglinton) is clearly being prepared for double track, as is the segment from Lawrence up to Steeles. If ML is planning to leave a segment of single track from Eglinton to Lawrence, that's new information, and is a bit at odds with the premise of 2WAD on 15 minute or better headways. I would expect that a 2-platform station would be prudent if not essential for that level of traffic.

Possibly ML has changed its mind, or has decided on a service plan that offers only limited service at Caledonia, or ONExpress has offered a new view. OR possibly the second platform has been deferred for cash flow reasons. Or possibly it's just a disconnect between the designers and the PR people who asked for some fresh renderings..

If ML is now saying single track....I would say this is a classic example of ML changing its mind too frequently and not sticking with a plan.... as well as not being transparent about the scope of its work, and not being accountable for minimising rework and redundant re-planning. I continue to grind the axe about how detailed scope for all ML projects needs to be discoverable, and changes to scope need to be minuted and also discoverable.

BTW the EA for the Caledonia GO was initiated in April 2015 and the RFP for design of the station was let in July 2020. And here we are in July 2024, waiting to hear who is selected to build the station. Construction will take 3-4 years. This is not the steady expeditious flow of progress that Mr Verster waxes poetic about in Board meetings.

- Paul

 

[dowlingm]

Even if a second GO Caledonia platform was built now, how much use of it would occur prior to electrification given Metrolinx’ promise not to increase diesel movements as part of the Davenport overpass process? Of course, the upside would be forgoing construction inflation, and disruption during 2nd platform retrofit. But there are a lot of projects in play and I’m just happy to see some progress on this

 

[Northern Light]

BTW the EA for the Caledonia GO was initiated in April 2015 and the RFP for design of the station was let in July 2020. And here we are in July 2024, waiting to hear who is selected to build the station. Construction will take 3-4 years. This is not the steady expeditious flow of progress that Mr Verster waxes poetic about in Board meetings.

- Paul

Just to give people a sense of what relentless progress would actually look like.........

The relevant EA, properly scoped is largely deliverable in six months, The RFP for design can be turned out immediately thereafter and be awarded in 90 days and complete inside a year. That would put us roughly up to where we are now, except it all could have been finished by 2018, if not earlier. The blather of Mx Execs notwithstanding, Caledonia Station, even while running normal weekday service is not a 3-4 year construction project if properly managed. I would argue 2 years is a stretch, but believable.

Toronto and Ontario have been let down too often by teams who honestly can and should deliver better, sooner.

 

[reaperexpress]

Even if a second GO Caledonia platform was built now, how much use of it would occur prior to electrification given Metrolinx’ promise not to increase diesel movements as part of the Davenport overpass process? Of course, the upside would be forgoing construction inflation, and disruption during 2nd platform retrofit. But there are a lot of projects in play and I’m just happy to see some progress on this

Since when do Metrolinx promises mean anything?

 

[reaperexpress]

It's always risky to take renderings too literally (although sometimes they reveal important details that no one has talked about) - but -

First, I reported what was approved in the TPAP, ie two station tracks and one "express" track. The TPAP is now almost a decade old. There have been various iterations to the plan since then, and so the TPAP is somewhat ancient history - except that, having gotten EA approval, it will be easier to proceed all the way to triple track if that is ever actually needed. But the best answer at the moment is - while parts of the corridor including Caledonia GO could possibly be built out to three tracks some day, and ML's construction includes futureproofing towards that, it's pretty clear that ML is not proceeding to that for the immediate future..

Second - has ML abandoned double track? If so, they aren't saying.... despite having repeatedly declared they are double tracking all the way to Maple at least. The roadbed segment south of Caledonia GO (ie the flyover, and northwards from it to just south of Eglinton) is clearly being prepared for double track, as is the segment from Lawrence up to Steeles. If ML is planning to leave a segment of single track from Eglinton to Lawrence, that's new information, and is a bit at odds with the premise of 2WAD on 15 minute or better headways. I would expect that a 2-platform station would be prudent if not essential for that level of traffic.

Possibly ML has changed its mind, or has decided on a service plan that offers only limited service at Caledonia, or ONExpress has offered a new view. OR possibly the second platform has been deferred for cash flow reasons. Or possibly it's just a disconnect between the designers and the PR people who asked for some fresh renderings..

If ML is now saying single track....I would say this is a classic example of ML changing its mind too frequently and not sticking with a plan.... as well as not being transparent about the scope of its work, and not being accountable for minimising rework and redundant re-planning. I continue to grind the axe about how detailed scope for all ML projects needs to be discoverable, and changes to scope need to be minuted and also discoverable.

BTW the EA for the Caledonia GO was initiated in April 2015 and the RFP for design of the station was let in July 2020. And here we are in July 2024, waiting to hear who is selected to build the station. Construction will take 3-4 years. This is not the steady expeditious flow of progress that Mr Verster waxes poetic about in Board meetings.

- Paul

Building only a single platform in the first phase made sense way back in the early 2010's when the station was originally designed, but now that construction has been delayed it seems that the station would open around the same time as the double track anyway. Failing to include the second platform in the first phase of the GO station construction could result in a similar situation that we had at Milliken station where a second track was built through the station, and then immediately demolished without ever having served a train to make room for construction of a second platform.

 

[cplchanb]

Building only a single platform in the first phase made sense way back in the early 2010's when the station was originally designed, but now that construction has been delayed it seems that the station would open around the same time as the double track anyway. Failing to include the second platform in the first phase of the GO station construction could result in a similar situation that we had at Milliken station where a second track was built through the station, and then immediately demolished without ever having served a train to make room for construction of a second platform.

similar to the situation with the roadworks on 16th ave across from the former buttonville airport. its taken so long to construct that the brand new short stubby street lights designed based on the run way restrictions are
obsolete before they even get a chance to power on since theres no longer any airport.... sad how slow things are here..

 

[just east of the creek]

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I am assuming that as they did not 'shimmy' Burloak to one side or the other (for which there is plenty of room, especially the eastern side) they are still planning on closing Burloak for a period of time (at some point) to complete the bridge.