[nfitz]

The plan was (maybe still is) to demolish the south platform for extra track space, meaning Lakeshore East trains would no longer serve Scarborough GO.

Seems like a silly idea given that there's so much space between the east (a lot more east than south!) and any structure (well other than those over-built bus-shelters.

 

[reaperexpress]

I was told once that 4 tracks to Long Branch would require a new Browns Line Bridge, fairly pricey undertaking. Plus an additional bridge over Etobicoke Creek.

And if we want the 4th track to reach Port Credit we also need an additional bridge over Dixie Rd and a widened embankment on the south side of Port Credit station including a new station building.

But a 'fairly pricy undertaking' is probably still worthwhile given that we're talking about Canada's busiest rail corridor by ridership, and the first line planned to be electrified in Ontario.

Adding a fourth track through Long Branch would help a fair bit by enabling express trains in both directions to overtake locals heading in and out of Toronto.

Quad tracks west of Port Credit into Clarkson will require a lot of work and br a tight fit with residential neighbourhoods backing onto the tracks, plus the ravines etc.

Just getting the quad track to Port Credit would already be a big improvement since Oakville-Toronto is the busiest portion of the line and of that portion, Port Credit - Toronto has the biggest average speed difference between express and local services (since express trains stop at either PC or Clarkson anyway). Keep in mind that the capacity benefit in this case comes from reducing conflict between local and express trains, not the theoretical line capacity itself, so that benefit still applies even if the Port Credit - Clarkson segment is only 3 tracks.

Signalling upgrades would be called for.

And electrification? Or at least infrastructure where it makes sense as these changes would be made.

Also Bayview. Do you extend these alterations/improvements through to the Bayview Junction (at considerable cost and multiple ownerships) and then around the corner into West Harbour and beyond?

The possibilities are large, the appetitive, well maybe more bite sized?

If it were up to me, we would start with a project to extend the quad track from Mimico to just west of Port Credit, which includes electrification and ETCS installation since both of those things are planned to start construction very soon on LSW anyway.

Bayview Junction is a mostly independent question since it's outside of the ETCS and Electrification scope. For the sake of project timelines it's probably best to prioritize any track expansions within the ETCS/Electric area (Burlington - Toronto - Oshawa) since it becomes much more expensive to shift tracks around after overhead poles are installed. At the very least they need to create a very optimistic track layout for Lakeshore and protect for that layout during the installation of catenary poles.

 

[Sauga89]

And if we want the 4th track to reach Port Credit we also need an additional bridge over Dixie Rd and a widened embankment on the south side of Port Credit station including a new station building.
View attachment 682850

But a 'fairly pricy undertaking' is probably still worthwhile given that we're talking about Canada's busiest rail corridor by ridership, and the first line planned to be electrified in Ontario.

Adding a fourth track through Long Branch would help a fair bit by enabling express trains in both directions to overtake locals heading in and out of Toronto.


Just getting the quad track to Port Credit would already be a big improvement since Oakville-Toronto is the busiest portion of the line and of that portion, Port Credit - Toronto has the biggest average speed difference between express and local services (since express trains stop at either PC or Clarkson anyway). Keep in mind that the capacity benefit in this case comes from reducing conflict between local and express trains, not the theoretical line capacity itself, so that benefit still applies even if the Port Credit - Clarkson segment is only 3 tracks.

If it were up to me, we would start with a project to extend the quad track from Mimico to just west of Port Credit, which includes electrification and ETCS installation since both of those things are planned to start construction very soon on LSW anyway.

Bayview Junction is a mostly independent question since it's outside of the ETCS and Electrification scope. For the sake of project timelines it's probably best to prioritize any track expansions within the ETCS/Electric area (Burlington - Toronto - Oshawa) since it becomes much more expensive to shift tracks around after overhead poles are installed. At the very least they need to create a very optimistic track layout for Lakeshore and protect for that layout during the installation of catenary poles.

Port Credit could also perhaps use a new tunnel entrance to its island platform farther west if there's new condo development west of the river. I don't know if it would be worth the cost though.

Also, on the subject of express trains, because express trains bypass Port Credit, PC actually has less frequent service than Cooksville in the morning peak.

 

[drum118]

To have 4 tracks from east of Brown Line to Burlington, you need a bridge at Long Branch, Brown Line,, Credit River, 16 Mile Creek,,Bronte and few more place. There are bridges that will support a 4th or 5th track easy. From what I have seen first hand, don't need to widen the Hurontario bridge for the 4th track today. When you place a 4th track bridge over the Credit River, you are hiding the 2 historial bridges
like the 3rd track bridge is today.

The green line for Port Credit station is the similar to the EA options when the 3rd line was plan from Port Credit to Burlington with the 3rd line going on the north side.

THere is a need for a 2nd tunnel today and needs to be part of the conversion of the side south platform to an island platform, Back for the 3rd track expansion, there was thinking of moving the south platform to go over Hurontario St and still can happen with some bridge widening.

Unless things change over the next 25 years, Lakeshore West will remain the heaviest ridship line that you need more express trains from various stations with all not being 12 car trains. With the amount of development taking place within of a mile of PC Station, ridership will spike for that station badly. to the point service will be every 10 minutes or less. Same goes for Clarkson that will rely the car.

 

[Bojaxs]

My thinking was a fourth track on LSW would help to increase express trains for people who live beyond Hamilton. You often hear people who live in St. Catherine's or Niagara Falls complain about their trips taking roughly 2 hours if they catch a "milk run" train.

 

[T3G]

The plan was (maybe still is) to demolish the south platform for extra track space, meaning Lakeshore East trains would no longer serve Scarborough GO.

Would installing new switches before and after the station so that LE trains can still stop at Scarborough not be an option?

 

[crs1026]

Would installing new switches before and after the station so that LE trains can still stop at Scarborough not be an option?

The switches will likely remain, but the ability to cross trains over will be more restricted once headways are reduced, as each crossover move conflicts with thru movements.

- Paul

 

[WB62]

Would installing new switches before and after the station so that LE trains can still stop at Scarborough not be an option?

ST and LE local service sharing the single island platform takes away too much capacity from both lines, LE westbound trains would be stopping at a platform ST eastbound trains use. That’s something technically possible if the headways are massive, but not service every 15 minutes or less.

LE trains would also only be able to stop in a single direction:

 

[ShonTron]

How is it that Metrolinx claims it can’t run LE Express trains on two tracks between Danforth and Don River, yet it would operate on two pairs of segregated tracks for the two services in the future?

Make this make sense to me.

 

[Fritter]

How is it that Metrolinx claims it can’t run LE Express trains on two tracks between Danforth and Don River, yet it would operate on two pairs of segregated tracks for the two services in the future?

Make this make sense to me.

Metrolinx math is often quoted amongst front line staff when trying to figure out plans and policies from above.

 

[nfitz]

ST and LE local service sharing the single island platform takes away too much capacity from both lines, LE westbound trains would be stopping at a platform ST eastbound trains use. That’s something technically possible if the headways are massive, but not service every 15 minutes or less.

LE trains would also only be able to stop in a single direction:

View attachment 683058

What's the source of that? Why would they remove a perfectly good platform on the east side, with so much space between the platform and any of the buildings/tunnel exits, etc.?

 

[WB62]

What's the source of that? Why would they remove a perfectly good platform on the east side, with so much space between the platform and any of the buildings/tunnel exits, etc.?

It’s not an official diagram from Metrolinx, it’s a recreation of the by someone on social media.

The plan to switch Scarborough to ST has already been shown in The Trillium article seen earlier this year:

 

[nfitz]

It’s not an official diagram from Metrolinx, it’s a recreation of the by someone on social media.

The plan to switch Scarborough to ST has already been shown in The Trillium article seen earlier this year:

That's more a short-term operational issue, than unnecessarily removing platforms!

 

[crs1026]

ST and LE local service sharing the single island platform takes away too much capacity from both lines, LE westbound trains would be stopping at a platform ST eastbound trains use. That’s something technically possible if the headways are massive, but not service every 15 minutes or less.

LE trains would also only be able to stop in a single direction:

Run the ST line wrong-main, and you can interleave westbound trains so both use the platform. (That is, if that doesn't complicate the use of the ladders east of Union)

Showing the westbound LSE trains having to cross over but not stop makes me cringe, an unnecessary speed restriction. Having the ST trains cross over is less of a problem as they are stopping anyways.

I presume that the two top tracks east of the junction are for the Midland yard? I'm not aware of LSE being more than three tracks east of the interlocking.

- Paul

 

[PShells]

An additional Fourth Track early work notice for the LSE corridor was published. This is in addition to the previous notice for the Gerrard to Woodbine fourth track segment that will initially be used to store rail equipment on a siding and the Danforth GO station renovations to accommodate a fourth track.


Birchmount to Kennedy segment (with no mention of replacing the bridge)

https://assets.metrolinx.com/image/upload/Images/Metrolinx/Toronto%20East/Notice_EarlyWorks_Birchmount_Sep192025.pdf