[C_Johnson_1995]

https://www.sudbury.com/local-news/bmi-group-wants-to-put-wood-back-to-work-with-espanola-bio-hub-mill-concept-10517202

Biochar could put Espanola on the comeback trail

BMI Group inks partnership deal with CHAR Technologies to put wood waste residuals back to work

www.northernontariobusiness.com

There is no firm plans announced, but talks of bio fuels/biochar as being what it will produce, of which will need the railway to be viable again. I personally worked there before and the discussion was without the railway we would need several trucks a day just for the various chemicals we used. So, if the plant is to start backup, the railway is needed.It does not mean it needs to be at mainline standards, but it still needs to be maintained to a safe level for transporting the goods needed.

Has this been openly discussed? Materials I have found about the mill thus far have not mentioned the railway. Do we know if biochar would be shipped out by rail? I wonder what volumes this and any potential inbound materials would produce.

 

[Metroscapes]

That is a given under current governance. How granular FN 'free, prior and informed consent' gets is a moving target.

I am not knowledgeable about road policy in the North, or about FN positions towards such.....but intuition tells me that if a private road is built through a remote area to haul a particular commodity, anybody living nearby will eventually want to use that road and have their community connected to it. I would bet that FN's would align to that... so long as they control the detailed design work and are not having something forced on them. Roads bring mobility and enable connectivity, which improves standard of living..

I am also pretty certain that the appetite both federally and provincially for resource projects will lead to some quiet bending of the status quo.... again, provided FNs' interests are aligned.

I am also ignorant about volumes and tonnage of mining products.... but I have seen railcars loaded with nickel concentrate packed in large white bags. One railcar carries 3-4 bags, the point being one bag is eminently truckable if needed, three bags on a railcar is more economical....provided the railway already exists, I suspect some careful cost-return decisions will be needed to consider whether the rail line is better on a life cycle basis.... but I expect there will be plenty of people advocating for the road option.

- Paul

Hence "May". A year ago, it would have been "must". If FN say they need the fixed line to connect to their community, it may happen. It also might now. We have yet to see what this new government actually will do when it comes to FN.

1. Kátł'odeeche First Nation, Northwest Territories Association of Communities, [...], Gwich’in Tribal Council, Inuvialuit Regional Corporation

2. A key driver of cost-of-living in remote communities is fuel and groceries. They were already high before COVID. In the past 5 years, you've seen your grocery bills go up. How much more crippling do you think that's been for these communities. Deliveries by rail are way cheaper than flying stuff in. It can be a lifeline over the medium- and long-term.
3. Access and presence in the North is an important service in today's political and environmental climate. Hay River makes for an excellent springboard for cheaper transported goods.
4. Kátł'odeeche First Nation has a Land Code. That significantly changes their ability and freedom to economically operate compared to other FNs. Operating a railway (or event following the Guelph Junction Railway method of being a shareholder and contracting operations) would be well within their reach with federal and territorial support.

 

[micheal_can]

One of the earlier proponents floated the idea of a private haul road and that went over like a lead balloon with the FNs. Unless the policy has changed (and not considering any federal involvement which always complicate things), if a road receives public (provincial) funding, it has to be open to the public. This would be similar to the Sultan Road between Chapleau and Hwy 144. It is open to the public on a 'your own risk' basis and normal HTA rules such as vehicle dimensions don't apply. It was also up to the company (E.B Eddy at the time) how and when they maintained it.

The full length and breadth of FN consent is yet to be hammered out.

I am also so ignorant, and I don't recall ever seeing tonnage/production rates for the project; which isn't surprising as it is proprietary information. I don't recall any of the proposals saying that they were intending to build a concentrator on-site but, then again, they didn't say they wouldn't. It would require mor energy on-site (something else that I don't recall being discussed) but it would certainly reduce the amount to be hauled out vs raw crushed ore.

The trick is to provide enough product - in one form or another - to keep a mill/refinery operating efficiently. Depending on the mineral and process, a mill/refinery can be fed from multiple mines. The output of Kidd Creek near Timmins is rail-hauled (concentrated) to Rouyn-Noranda to be processed along with products from other mines. The golden ticket from the RofF is chromite, and I'm not aware of any other chromite mine or refinery in Canada let alone Ontario.

The Chromite smelter is supposed to be built in SSM. This would mean using the CN and Algoma Central lines to get down to it.

Has this been openly discussed? Materials I have found about the mill thus far have not mentioned the railway. Do we know if biochar would be shipped out by rail? I wonder what volumes this and any potential inbound materials would produce.

Nothing one way or the other. It may have been one of the selling points, but may not have been expressed openly in public.

 

[micheal_can]

1. 
   
2. A key driver of cost-of-living in remote communities is fuel and groceries. They were already high before COVID. In the past 5 years, you've seen your grocery bills go up. How much more crippling do you think that's been for these communities. Deliveries by rail are way cheaper than flying stuff in. It can be a lifeline over the medium- and long-term.
3. Access and presence in the North is an important service in today's political and environmental climate. Hay River makes for an excellent springboard for cheaper transported goods.
4. Kátł'odeeche First Nation has a Land Code. That significantly changes their ability and freedom to economically operate compared to other FNs. Operating a railway (or event following the Guelph Junction Railway method of being a shareholder and contracting operations) would be well within their reach with federal and territorial support.

This is something someone in downtown Toronto does not understand. The costs for food in these communities would shock most Canadians. They may pay upwards of a dollar for a single apple. Not a bag, or by the pound, but one. If it weren't for the ice roads, the fuel to generate electricity would be impossible to supply. This is where we need to watch how the FN are treated when it comes to major projects..

 

[lenaitch]

The Chromite smelter is supposed to be built in SSM. This would mean using the CN and Algoma Central lines to get down to it.

Right, but the discussion is how to get it to 'civilization'; either a railhead near Nakina or Hwy 599 at Pickle Lake (I recall seeing that one floated - I don't know how much traction it had). It's the first ~300km that are the tricky bit.

 

[crs1026]

This is something someone in downtown Toronto does not understand. The costs for food in these communities would shock most Canadians. They may pay upwards of a dollar for a single apple. Not a bag, or by the pound, but one. If it weren't for the ice roads, the fuel to generate electricity would be impossible to supply. This is where we need to watch how the FN are treated when it comes to major projects..

It is well understood. But there is little evidence that a railway is always pursued or used where it is available. The Moosonee and Hudsons Bay lines clearly do … but they are not the only wilderness railways in Canada.
If this were compellung, would Hay River not already have such a distribution customer ?
One can certainly argue that this would be a good idea…. But how often does it rise to the A priority category when negotiating capital and infrastructure needs for FN’s ?


- Paul

 

[micheal_can]

It is well understood. But there is little evidence that a railway is always pursued or used where it is available. The Moosonee and Hudsons Bay lines clearly do … but they are not the only wilderness railways in Canada.
If this were compellung, would Hay River not already have such a distribution customer ?
One can certainly argue that this would be a good idea…. But how often does it rise to the A priority category when negotiating capital and infrastructure needs for FN’s ?


- Paul

I'llbe honest,I do not fully understand the politics of FN in NWT. However,IIRC, the main driver of that distribution would be across the lake to Yellowknife. I am wondering if the opening of the bridge over the river has made this rail line redundant.

 

[crs1026]

^ The MacKenzie Highway pretty much removes any argument about Hay River needing to remain a ferryport. Yep, road is good all the way to Yellowknife.

- Paul

 

[lenaitch]

The driving distance from Hay River to Yellowknife is about 480km, about 2.5x the barge distance, but it is year-round and likely preferred by shippers and customers (you don't have to buy a season's worth of product). The MacKenzie Highway serves Inuvik and north, but comes in from Yukon. The 'missing middle' is servicing communities on the lake itself and on the Mackenzie River via barge. The government Marine Transportation Service still shows sailing schedules from Hay River to the Arctic Ocean. No doubt removing a city of approx. 20000 people (about 1/2 of the entire NWT population) reduced the volume demand for barge service significantly.

Barge services have been hampered by low water levels in recent years.

 

[Allandale25]

Ceremonial run happening today and service starts Monday.

Amtrak officially returns to the Coast August 18 with four stops in Mississippi

Dignitaries, including Mississippi U.S. Senator Roger Wicker, will take a ceremonial first ride on the new passenger rail service on Saturday.

magnoliatribune.com

 

[drum118]

Ontario Tech and Hitachi Rail sign Memorandum of Understanding​

Hitachi Rail Signs MOU With Ontario Tech University to Support Railway Engineering Specialization​

 

[Bordercollie]

Ontario Tech and Hitachi Rail sign Memorandum of Understanding​

They have an office in Toronto? And they have been developing technology for 40 years but not for Toronto....

 

[Bojaxs]

Goreway bridge going over the CN mainline. (Malton side, looking north)

 

[urbancog]

Another example here of partial electrification and use of bi-mode electric + battery rolling stock. This time on the Scottish Borders Railway.

The last few miles into Edinburgh is already electrified for the East Coast Main Line. Presumably the trains will have enough charge-time by combining this with the short new electrified section at the North end, and about 6 miles of electrification into Tweedbank station at the South. It looks like only about 20% of the overall line will get overhead electrification.

 

[crs1026]

Another example here of partial electrification and use of bi-mode electric + battery rolling stock. This time on the Scottish Borders Railway.

The last few miles into Edinburgh is already electrified for the East Coast Main Line. Presumably the trains will have enough charge-time by combining this with the short new electrified section at the North end, and about 6 miles of electrification into Tweedbank station at the South. It looks like only about 20% of the overall line will get overhead electrification.

Do you have a source that identifies this railway as using battery power ?

As it happens I was just in Edinburgh, and saw what I thought was a DMU trainset mu'd to an EMU trainset. Are there actually battery trains out there ? Or just DMU beyond the wires ?

- Paul

PS I also found an op-ed in the Edinburgh paper this past week, complaining that the Borders Railway was both overspent and overcrowded.... apparently more successful than expected and now being considered for extension, but there was a lot of sticker shock over a pricetag that sounded modest by Ontario standards..... the point being, we in Ontario may be heading into a bit of a recalibration about affordability.