[Waterloo_Guy]

I imagine that by the time such measure come into place, much of this rezoning will already be done. Does anyone here know the likely process and outcome?

 

[steveintoronto]

I imagine that by the time such measure come into place, much of this rezoning will already be done. Does anyone here know the likely process and outcome?

To build, you have to demolish what's there first, and since what's there now is a good part residential, then the City is able to block granting a demolition permit until such time as Council revisits policy.

 

[Waterloo_Guy]

To build, you have to demolish what's there first, and since what's there now is a good part residential, then the City is able to block granting a demolition permit until such time as Council revisits policy.

I don't think there is anything residential here apart from the new developments.

 

[freshcutgrass]

It's hardly an ideal situation to have to walk from Carlton & Yonge to Bay & King. You can increase density without affecting quality of life but spending more and more on infrastructure just becomes prohibitively expensive. We will need more than just the Relief Line the direction downtown is going given our current road capacities.

But you are missing the entire point. These 900 units are being added to the city one way or another. All I am saying, is that having them at Yonge & Carlton puts less strain on roads and transit than if they were built outside of downtown. A much higher percentage of these residents will be walking and cycling for work, shopping/pleasure trips. And much fewer will be driving. And the transit users will be of the short trip variety...and short trips are transit gold.

The percentage of people on the roads and on the subway between Bloor and King that are represented by the people who live between Bloor and King is closer to zero than you imagine.

 

[freshcutgrass]

Well, the shid has hit the fan:

http://www.metronews.ca/news/toront...-for-pause-button-on-yonge-street-condos.html

Oh god...is Keesmaat at it again telling us how we can't flush that many toilets?

"Keesmaat says developers are still pitching huge condo towers along stretches of Yonge where the density is already on par with London, England."

That doesn't even make any sense...ALL of London, England is on par with London, England. So whoop-dee-doo if a tiny chunk of Yonge St is???? I assume London, England doesn't import their city planners from Peterborough, Ontario either.

The biggest overhaul of infrastructure this city needs is at 100 Queen St West.

 

[gabe]

People use far too much salt here as well. It's hell on shoes and pants, as well as infrastructure and vehicles.

That's Toronto way. Instead of shoveling just throw a truck load of salt down, then put up a "Caution slippery sign"

 

[maestro]

But you are missing the entire point. These 900 units are being added to the city one way or another. All I am saying, is that having them at Yonge & Carlton puts less strain on roads and transit than if they were built outside of downtown. A much higher percentage of these residents will be walking and cycling for work, shopping/pleasure trips. And much fewer will be driving. And the transit users will be of the short trip variety...and short trips are transit gold.

Actually I got the point. I just don't agree that the downtown will continue as the be all and end all for a truly urban experience or that it can handle the capacity of a generation or two worth of these crazy dense proposal with inhuman stepbacks and spacing.

You really have the wrong impression of how I live. I don't care about commuters driving cars. I don't own one. Our narrow, widely spaced street have only so much capacity for pedestrians, cyclists and, the servicing needed to keep those store stocked and all the building's humming.

The percentage of people on the roads and on the subway between Bloor and King that are represented by the people who live between Bloor and King is closer to zero than you imagine.

That covers my point. People have to walk or ride to work whether they enjoy it on a daily basis or not. The subway is simply not a viable alternative.

 

[condovo]

Oh god...is Keesmaat at it again telling us how we can't flush that many toilets?

"Keesmaat says developers are still pitching huge condo towers along stretches of Yonge where the density is already on par with London, England."

That doesn't even make any sense...ALL of London, England is on par with London, England. So whoop-dee-doo if a tiny chunk of Yonge St is???? I assume London, England doesn't import their city planners from Peterborough, Ontario either.

The biggest overhaul of infrastructure this city needs is at 100 Queen St West.

What you chose not to quote from the article, and which makes the pause on development seem perfectly reasonable, is this:

“Every block is going to be under construction, but we don’t have expanded TTC capacity. I don’t have new affordable housing being built. We don’t have an increase in subsidized childcare spaces. I don’t even have wider sidewalks...”

 

[steveintoronto]

I don't think there is anything residential here apart from the new developments.

I meant hotel rooms, which aren't considered residential, but it's a moot point:

[...]
The proposal includes plans for a pair of 65-storey condo towers sitting atop a seven-storey podium, though current site zoning limits new buildings to a height of 61 metres, according to a cover letter included in the filing.

However, with reference to a “78-storey mixed-use building just south of the site,” the cover letter notes a development of this height wouldn’t be unprecedented for the immediate area.

At the southwest corner of Gerrard West and Yonge Street, a block south of 2 Carlton, the tallest residential tower in Canada clocks in at a towering 78 storeys. Aura earned the tallest title when developer Canderel completed the lofty 985-unit condo building in 2014. [...]

http://news.buzzbuzzhome.com/2016/10/72-storey-condo-towers-toronto.html

The City already has the power to block the application. If there's a problem, put it before council, and then see if the developer takes it to the OMB. If they do, the City can add new conditions on approval if the developer wins (highly unlikely) including surcharges for transit and other services. Those surcharges will be enough to kill the deal.

 

[steveintoronto]

Oh god...is Keesmaat at it again telling us how we can't flush that many toilets?

"Keesmaat says developers are still pitching huge condo towers along stretches of Yonge where the density is already on par with London, England."

That doesn't even make any sense...ALL of London, England is on par with London, England. So whoop-dee-doo if a tiny chunk of Yonge St is???? I assume London, England doesn't import their city planners from Peterborough, Ontario either.

The biggest overhaul of infrastructure this city needs is at 100 Queen St West.

Mmmm....you're in for a bit of a shock. Even the OMB wouldn't force this application through. And if they do, the City can take it to Ontario Superior Court to overturn it, which has been successful in a couple of other cases lately. The OMB is only the beginning of the legal appeal process.

 

[freshcutgrass]

What you chose not to quote from the article, and which makes the pause on development seem perfectly reasonable, is this:

“Every block is going to be under construction, but we don’t have expanded TTC capacity. I don’t have new affordable housing being built. We don’t have an increase in subsidized childcare spaces. I don’t even have wider sidewalks...”

Actually it makes even less sense, and was already covered by my previous post. If we seriously want to put a pause on development because the Yonge line is too packed, then the place to start is everywhere else, as well as stopping the Eglinton Crosstown, cause that's what feeds the Yonge Line. It isn't condo dwellers south of Bloor.

Subsidized housing and daycare has nothing to do with it. Wider sidewalks is a simple case of political will....and there isn't any in Toronto.

 

[steveintoronto]

If we seriously want to put a pause on development because the Yonge line is too packed, then the place to start is everywhere else,

"The place to stop is everywhere else". Fascinating statement of gobbledygook.

as well as stopping the Eglinton Crosstown, cause that's what feeds the Yonge Line.

Even more gobbledygook. Can't fit any more people into the car, so lets ban roadways...

 

[condovo]

Actually it makes even less sense, and was already covered by my previous post. If we seriously want to put a pause on development because the Yonge line is too packed, then the place to start is everywhere else, as well as stopping the Eglinton Crosstown, cause that's what feeds the Yonge Line. It isn't condo dwellers south of Bloor.

Subsidized housing and daycare has nothing to do with it. Wider sidewalks is a simple case of political will....and there isn't any in Toronto.

It's all about building a complete, liveable community not a Dubai-like showcase. Height for height's sake and density for density's sake is just never going to happen here. Never. Sorry.

 

[steveintoronto]

It's all about building a complete, liveable community not a Dubai-like showcase. Height for height's sake and density for density's sake is just never going to happen here. Never. Sorry.

It's interesting, and this string is showing this too...as does Keesmaat's statement yesterday, that a criticality has been reached where apparently the majority of Torontonians are saying "enough!"

As much as the City has been ineffective in applying the existing planning regs and zoning, (for a litany of reasons, not least an ineffective Council, sometimes over-ruling their own Planning Staff) it remains to be seen if Keesmaat can make good her lofty outrage. The OMB is another matter again, I'm no fan, but again, a lot has been dropped in their lap because councils are so....'unaccountable' on many decisions. And we elect them! In all fairness, the Municipal Act and derivations (Toronto Act, etc) and Municipal Elections Act and related are faulty creatures of Queen's Park, so the province is also due fair amount of criticism on this. If municipal government was held to the same strictures as provincial government is, we might all be a lot better off, but ultimately, we get the government we deserve.

I do think a turning point has been reached, but we will see.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

It's all about building a complete, liveable community not a Dubai-like showcase. Height for height's sake and density for density's sake is just never going to happen here. Never. Sorry.

Indeed - hardly anyone is against the notion of having more density in the core, especially on this board - but it's one thing to support it an orderly, logical and beneficial manner; another to have it done as a free-for-all.

If municipal government was held to the same strictures as provincial government is, we might all be a lot better off, but ultimately, we get the government we deserve.

Would we be better off necessarily? Expediency is just as prevalent at that level.

AoD