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Mark Carney calls emergency meeting of first ministers in Muskoka​


From https://www.thestar.com/politics/provincial/mark-carney-calls-emergency-meeting-of-first-ministers-in-muskoka/article_e8e9f5e5-bfc4-439a-9e53-8e40fa86ed56.html?utm_medium=social&utm_source=copy-link&utm_campaign=user-share

U.S. President Donald Trump’s trade war against Canada is triggering crisis talks in cottage country.

Prime Minister Mark Carney is convening an emergency first ministers’ meeting in Huntsville before the start of the annual premiers’ confab on July 22.

That surprise announcement Friday followed Trump’s latest escalation of his tariff threats targeting Canada.

It comes only weeks after Carney held an FMM in Saskatoon last month to discuss trade challenges and other national priorities.

Ontario’s Progressive Conservative Premier Doug Ford, a close ally of the recently elected Liberal prime minister, got the ball in motion for the meeting.

“In the face of President Trump’s latest threat, we need to come together,” Ford said on social media.

“We need a plan on how Canada will respond and how we’ll protect our workers, businesses and communities,” the premier said.

“I’ve asked and Prime Minister Carney has agreed to an in-person First Ministers’ Meeting on Tuesday, July 22 in Huntsville ahead of the Council of the Federation meeting with Canada’s premiers,” he said.

“Together, we’re going to remain united as we protect Ontario and protect Canada.”

Ford, chair of the premiers’ council, is hosting their COF summer meeting in Muskoka.

Carney and the premiers are hoping the Trump chaos will force Ottawa and the provinces to co-operate more in pushing infrastructure projects and more diversified trade.

That includes ridding the country of interprovincial trade barriers. So far Ford has inked deals with every province except Quebec, British Columbia and Newfoundland and Labrador to remove internal barriers to trade.

“We are building Canada strong,” said Carney.

“The federal government, provinces and territories are making significant progress in building one Canadian economy,” added the prime minister.

“We are poised to build a series of major new projects in the national interest. We are strengthening our trading partnerships throughout the world.”
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No doubt Deerhurst. Although somewhat isolated compared to an urban area (good for security), let's pick a place that is really hard to access from across the country.

I don't expect them to slum at a Super 8 on an airport strip, and conferences like this need a venue large enough for the clingons and entourage, but Muskoka just screams elitism. I'm actually kinda surprised they found a suitabel venue on short notice during high season.
 
lenaitch said:
No doubt Deerhurst. Although somewhat isolated compared to an urban area (good for security), let's pick a place that is really hard to access from across the country.

I don't expect them to slum at a Super 8 on an airport strip, and conferences like this need a venue large enough for the clingons and entourage, but Muskoka just screams elitism. I'm actually kinda surprised they found a suitabel venue on short notice during high season.
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Just for clarity, there is no short notice and this is not an emergency meeting. This is the annual Premiers meeting which has been planned for months (Council of the Federation); Premier Ford as host asked the PM to join, he said yes.

The hyperbolic headlines are more than a little misleading.
 
Northern Light said:
Just for clarity, there is no short notice and this is not an emergency meeting. This is the annual Premiers meeting which has been planned for months (Council of the Federation); Premier Ford as host asked the PM to join, he said yes.

The hyperbolic headlines are more than a little misleading.
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Thanks for that. It makes more sense than a bunch of tourists kicked out of their rooms!
 
Admiral Beez said:
I wonder if that includes the oil and gas needed to power the electric trains we see much of the world using.
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I get why those ignorant about thermodynamics think this is done kind of gotchya.

If you pick up a Thermo textbook, you'll learn how much efficiency scales with size in power plants. Beyond that, you'll learn that electricity is incredibly efficient to transmit and transfer. Finally, you'll learn that electric motors are incredibly efficient too. Add it all up and an electric car or train running on power generated by burning gas or oil is still as efficient or more, than equivalent hybrid versions.

But this is just the first part. Centralized generation also has the benefit of enabling pollution controls and the use of alternatives. I would think someone who is very proud of their British heritage would know about Britain's incredible success with renewables, notably offshore wind:

88e0cc00-cc48-11ef-94cb-5f844ceb9e30.png.webp


www.bbc.com

Record year for wind power in Great Britain in 2024

Wind provided more electricity than ever last year across England, Wales and Scotland.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com

Lastly, a consideration that most Canadians are clueless about, but every energy importing country is always pre-occupied with: energy security. Nobody can stop the wind from blowing or the sun from shining. But they most certainly can cut off your supplies of oil and gas, or hold you hostage to them (as Europe is now discovering with Russia) or just jack up the price and mess with your economy (70s oil crisis). Nothing creates strategic flexibility like renewables, and to a lesser extent, nuclear.
 
afransen said:
P

Pretty much all new incremental electric power generation is nob-fossil.
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Public knowledge is always a decade or two behind reality. The lag is worse depending on political bias.

Like solar is so cheap now that Germans can buy PV panels at grocery stores, hang them off balconies and cut their apartment power bill. Extremely useful if that balcony solar cuts demand during peak time of use.

If you follow this stuff, the dissonance between reality and public discourse is wild. We're at a point where 90% of all new global power generation is renewable. This includes a lot of poor places in the world. Yet, the majority of folks still think it's some eco fad that will pass.

e360.yale.edu

Renewables Made Up More Than 90 Percent of New Power Installed Globally Last Year

e360.yale.edu e360.yale.edu

By the way, I did a post grad certificate on cleantech at an American service academy, on exchange, during Trump's first term, concurrently with my other two Masters. Political rhetoric will not overcome reality. And every military is interested in the tech because of tactical advantages. I had combat veteran classmates interested in electric drives because of the silence, low thermal signature and fuel efficiency. I had classmates who lost friends on logistics runs who understood that solar panels, cutting back on diesel demand for generators, saves lives. But then you get online and some armchair keyboard warrior will say they are "woke". This was Afghanistan a decade and a half ago:

 
While I want to say we ought not to get carried away w/turning this into the Green Energy thread....... I'll defer that, to after this post, LOL

I was curious to see where we are at in Ontario today:

1752338163323.png


Source ; https://www.ieso.ca/power-data

The wind is a very solid number for today, given the intense sun outside, the solar seems light. (pun intended)

***

The Energy Demand forecast for Ontario would be of interest to some:

1752338440444.png


The forecast for installed capacity is strange:

1752338598824.png


So where does the wind/solar go you ask? The assumption made here is that any contracted supply disappears when the contract now in place expires. To be clear, this is not what will unfold, but is being used
to inform future procurement.

Here's where we stand today in installed capacity:

1752338687578.png


I don't recall seeing this detailed a schedule for nuclear:


1752338741308.png

The latter tables are all from the 2025 Planning Outlook, here: https://www.ieso.ca/-/media/Files/I...sts/apo/2025/2025-Annual-Planning-Outlook.pdf
 
The tragedy with Ontario's energy policy is that we went from one extreme to the other. We've gone from Liberals willing to spend anything on green energy to Conservatives willing to spend anything to ignore cleantech despite how cheap it is these days. It's insane, for example, that Ontario has wasted so much money and political capital on onshore wind and done nothing with offshore wind on the Great Lakes. Or that the Liberal government encouraged households to install solar and left massive commercial roofs empty. There's no reason why every Wal-Mart, Costco, Loblaws, Best Buy, etc roof should not be generating enough to take a chunk out of their demand. Especially given that Ontario's peaks fall on sunny summer days when AC demands spike.
 
kEiThZ said:
The tragedy with Ontario's energy policy is that we went from one extreme to the other. We've gone from Liberals willing to spend anything on green energy to Conservatives willing to spend anything to ignore cleantech despite how cheap it is these days. It's insane, for example, that Ontario has wasted so much money and political capital on onshore wind and done nothing with offshore wind on the Great Lakes. Or that the Liberal government encouraged households to install solar and left massive commercial roofs empty. There's no reason why every Wal-Mart, Costco, Loblaws, Best Buy, etc roof should not be generating enough to take a chunk out of their demand. Especially given that Ontario's peaks fall on sunny summer days when AC demands spike.
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Don't a lot of commercial roofs have solar panels in Ontario?
 
afransen said:
Don't a lot of commercial roofs have solar panels in Ontario?
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A quick scan of Toronto areas dominated by large flat roofs, such as Golden Mile, STC and Downsview suggests that the numbers are relatively low.

But 2 retailers stand out for consistently installing roof top solar.

1) Home Depot

2) Loblaws

In both cases, the majority of owned properties have intensive solar installations.

3) I looked at several Costco's, none had solar installed.

Among major mall owners:

1) Oxford has some solar and extensive roof on portions of Yorkdale and STC. Neither at Square One.

2) CF didn't not have any installed solar or green roof that I could see at Sherway or Fairview.

3) Riocan does not appear to have any commitment to solar.

Other:

The Toronto District School Board has extensive solar installations on its schools, well over 100 of them.

The TTC does not appear to have any commitment to solar, looking at their subway yard and bus depot locations.

Their newest facility, McNicoll Garage does have a majority green roof.
 
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kEiThZ said:
The tragedy with Ontario's energy policy is that we went from one extreme to the other. We've gone from Liberals willing to spend anything on green energy to Conservatives willing to spend anything to ignore cleantech despite how cheap it is these days. It's insane, for example, that Ontario has wasted so much money and political capital on onshore wind and done nothing with offshore wind on the Great Lakes. Or that the Liberal government encouraged households to install solar and left massive commercial roofs empty. There's no reason why every Wal-Mart, Costco, Loblaws, Best Buy, etc roof should not be generating enough to take a chunk out of their demand. Especially given that Ontario's peaks fall on sunny summer days when AC demands spike.
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Ontario has had a policy moratorium on offshore turbines since 2011. I recall a lot of pushback for a proposal in either the PEC or Kingston area and it seems subsequent governments have determined they're not worth the political capital expenditure.

 
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