wheelloader
New Member
Wonder why would T&T bail out, considering they are pretty successful at Fairview Mall location. Maybe lack of convenience of parking access to attract bulk customer?
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- Thread starter FinchConnection
- Start date
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
T&T bailed on lower level of NorthYorkCityCentre because:
- it would be expensive to repair (water-damage), retrofit (light-retail/office to supermarket) and transferring goods from loading docks would be a crap show,...
- lots of new mid-blocks retail space coming online (Ellie Condo & 90K-sqft at Pearl Place),...
- with Loblaws & ShoppersDrugMart across the street at EmpressWalk - local monopoly forming,... a T&T would really just take business away from the Loblaws,... where customer volume dropped after cheaper FoodBasics opened Oct 2021 at EmeraldPark south of Sheppard which really didn't happen as much when similar price-points Longos (July 2019) and WholeFoodsMarket (Sept 2014) opened at Yonge & Sheppard. This Loblaws store has been under-performing based on sales & profit margin per square footage,...
Now it looks like the Loblaws at RioCan EmpressWalk will close on October 26,... T&T will be taking over the Loblaws EmpressWalk retail space - well, most of it! Aiming to open Summer 2026,... but T&T's opening aim is really pissing in the dark!!!
The Loblaws is about 75,000-80,000sqft plus another 6,000sqft in P1 Parking level. Full sized T&T needs about 50,000sqft (their Urban-Format at 27,000sqft College near Spadina & 31,000sqft Edward near Yonge can't carry full selection/inventory),... so about 30,000sqft left over to divide/sublet for other retail usage.
Oh,... and if you're not a fan of all those little Asian retail shops/restaurants along Yonge,... you ain't seen nothing yet!!! Wherever a T&T opens - it's like the MotherShip, and all these other little Asian retail shop/restaurants/services opens nearby,... to form like a little Chinatown,...
fatty
New Member
This is huge news. May I ask how you know Loblaws is closing? I always thought this store performed well given how busy it always seems compared to the other supermarkets in the area
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
err,.. If I tell you,... I'm gonna have to,....
This EmpressWalk Loblaws haven't performed well in years - in terms of Sales & Profit Margin per size.
Sales volume at EmpressWalk Loblaws as well as YongeSheppardCentre's Longos and HullmarkCentre's WholeFoodsMarket are low,... EmpressWalk Loblaws and other area supermarkets along Yonge in North York caters to condo dwellers, who drops by a couple times a week, carrying out 1 or 2 bags of groceries,.... VS say any normal supermarket with large parking lot - catering to house customers who loads up a shopping cart once a week and fills the back of their SUV. Plus, Yonge & Sheppard is the only intersection in City with not 2 but 3 supermarkets!
It's common to see people walking by EmpressWalk with FoodBasics bags! In October 2021, cheaper FoodBasics opened at EmeraldPark - since then, EmpressWalk Loblaws customer volume dropped - didn't happen as much when similar price-points Longos (July 2019) and WholeFoodsMarket (Sept 2014) opened at Yonge & Sheppard. HullmarkCentre's WholeFoodsMarket with their expensive ground-level retail space with Yonge frontage - is a bottomless money pit,.. but it has Rich-Daddy Amazon!
Then compounding all this,... EmpressWalk Loblaws is closest supermarket to 5800 Yonge which hosted the largest Homeless Shelter in Canada from Spring 2020 to Fall 2023,... almost 500 Homeless people,... EmpressWalk Loblaws faced a lot of Shop-Lifting during that time,... forced to install security barrier/gates & hired additional security,...
EmpressWalk Loblaws has been under-performing for years,.... plus, about 10 years ago when many Loblaws were getting re-fresh facelift renovations,... this one didn't get any,.... so head-office was letting this store rot.
BucketOfBolts
New Member
I first saw this October 2025 closure and January 2026 T&T debut mentioned on Next Door a few days ago - with a skeptical poster asking a cashier on two separate shopping trips and both confirmed the closure. But unsure opening date and if January is realistic, or will be a little later as sunny mentions.
And as @sunnyraytoronto noted with the extra security measures at the Empress Walk Loblaws, I bailed on visiting this location maybe 1.5 years ago. Was tired of the scrutinizing security stares, the wrap-around chrome barrier, and customers trying to go back through the barrier (right next to security) for I'm sure a myriad of reasons - "just forgot something", getting a cart, staff using it as a shortcut, etc. - setting off the alarm and the alarm blaring constantly during every grocery trip giving me a headache. Very hostile and obnoxious experience to your customers. The store had also started to feel old and dirty, chipped floor tiles, occasionally sweet but mostly apathetic staff, etc. (I find the Bayview Village Loblaws much more efficiently run.) Could never get them to keep enough hand baskets in stock (complained multiple times) - "People keep stealing them" - "We've ordered them, orders take 18 months to come in", etc. (WTF kind of supply chain/availability issues are there on common supermarket hand baskets if it's 18 months delay?) - if I didn't have enough planned to want to use a cart. Just one day I quit going and go to Longo's instead.
Though it made a "prestige" list - of some sort - when Blogto voted it one of the worst four Loblaws locations years ago: https://www.blogto.com/eat_drink/2014/02/the_best_and_worst_loblaws_in_toronto/
fatty
New Member
I've been shopping at this Loblaws several times a week for the past decade. I agree with most of your points except for the extra security measures. I do not mind them if they are a deterrent to shoplifting. They do not make me feel uncomfortable at all. It's not the store's fault there are so many sketchy people in the area nowadays. It's gotten so bad in the past 10 years.I first saw this October 2025 closure and January 2026 T&T debut mentioned on Next Door a few days ago - with a skeptical poster asking a cashier on two separate shopping trips and both confirmed the closure. But unsure opening date and if January is realistic, or will be a little later as sunny mentions.
And as @sunnyraytoronto noted with the extra security measures at the Empress Walk Loblaws, I bailed on visiting this location maybe 1.5 years ago. Was tired of the scrutinizing security stares, the wrap-around chrome barrier, and customers trying to go back through the barrier (right next to security) for I'm sure a myriad of reasons - "just forgot something", getting a cart, staff using it as a shortcut, etc. - setting off the alarm and the alarm blaring constantly during every grocery trip giving me a headache. Very hostile and obnoxious experience to your customers. The store had also started to feel old and dirty, chipped floor tiles, occasionally sweet but mostly apathetic staff, etc. (I find the Bayview Village Loblaws much more efficiently run.) Could never get them to keep enough hand baskets in stock (complained multiple times) - "People keep stealing them" - "We've ordered them, orders take 18 months to come in", etc. (WTF kind of supply chain/availability issues are there on common supermarket hand baskets if it's 18 months delay?) - if I didn't have enough planned to want to use a cart. Just one day I quit going and go to Longo's instead.
Though it made a "prestige" list - of some sort - when Blogto voted it one of the worst four Loblaws locations years ago: https://www.blogto.com/eat_drink/2014/02/the_best_and_worst_loblaws_in_toronto/
Having said that, I can see from your and sunnyraytoronto's comments why it makes sense this Loblaws would close.
11th
Senior Member
Unless there's brand loyalty, there is little reason to visit the Empress Walk location unless you live in the condo towers right above. 15min walk to the south gets you access to 4 better options - three full size (low to high price points), one urban sized. If you really need a Loblaws, the Bayview Village location is a more pleasant experience; coupled with a much better LCBO.
It's good of them to finally hand this location over to T&T. You already see people on line 4 carrying T&T bags.
To add, the Metro few blocks north also feels dated, but not in as bad shape as the Empress Walk Loblaws.
It's good of them to finally hand this location over to T&T. You already see people on line 4 carrying T&T bags.
To add, the Metro few blocks north also feels dated, but not in as bad shape as the Empress Walk Loblaws.
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
Well,... in 5-10 years,... we'll probably be having this same conversation about this Metro store closing to become an Adonis,...
Adonis have shown some interest in Willowdale! Around 2016-2017, Metro was trying to off-load their 30,000sqft 2nd floor retail space at EmeraldPark (green building) to their Adonis division,... Adonis likes the area and demographic, but not that retail space (low visibility from Yonge, terrible parking, Adonis have experience with smaller Urban format store in Montreal)
Take a close look at the Metro at Church & Doris,.... they're letting it rot (has a lot of the same problems the EmpressWalk Loblaws has), it didn't get the corporate refresh renovation that was being considered 10 years ago, the Bayview & YorkMill Metro did!,... generally, when Metro store gets too old, it's converted to FoodBasics (just like old Loblaws stores become NoFrills),... but after Aoyuan did Metro/FoodBasics dirty at Newtonbrook Plaza - originally promising they can remain until Phase1 with ground-level supermarket retail space completed,... but forced their closure in Feb 2019 for demolition, so Aoyuan can put in their Temporary Sales Office for Phase2 - which never started,... FoodBasics was considered for this Metro location but Metro already stuck with empty EmeraldPark location and being sued by their "Coming Soon" LCBO store,.... so FoodBasics opened at Emerald Park in Oct 2021
Anyways, this is a good size Metro,... large enough for Adonis to add their on-site pita making factory - like the Eglinton & Warden Adonis,...
So what is Metro waiting for? Re-Development,... not here at Church & Doris,... but at their nearby Metro stores to figure out which Metro store they'll lose to Re-Development without being able to go back,... it's all about market-share (this & new Bathurst/Steeles amongst Metro most northern stores in this part of GTA),... their Yonge&Lawence Metro is in hot area, Lawrence&Bathurst Metro has redevelopment proposal,... but their closest Bathurst&Sheppard Metro is the most interesting - Downsview Airport is closed so area height limit is gone, Metrolinx is studying Sheppard Subway Extension West (Sheppard-Yonge to Sheppard West (formerly Downsview) Station) with Subway Station at that Sheppard & Bathurst,...
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
There's no way T&T would open in January 2026 - unless, all that happens is the new supermarket does touch-up paint and fill shelves with their stock and reopens - oh, that a TT store - ToneTai! They're filthy,... T&T reputation is for being clean - "the Chinese Loblaws",... T&T won't ruin their reputation by opening a filthy store.
This EmpressWalk Loblaws have not been renovated since it opened around 2000 - didn't even get the Black-Tiles/Red-Flooring job like many Loblaws did 10-15 years ago,... I expect T&T to basically gut this place,... minimal upgrade to piping, HVAC, wiring, wifi,.... all floors and walls redone to T&T colours,.... add more ready hot-food stations, market-stations. Plus, at about 75,000-80,000sqft plus another 6,000sqft in P1 Parking level,... Full sized T&T only needs about 40,000-50,000sqft (I'd be disappointed if they go Urban Format 30,000sqft here),... with about 30,000sqft left over, that'll probably be sublet into a little FoodCourt/FoodHall like what was done with T&T going into FairviewMall - likely right at the bottom of that open pit/atrium (where EmpressWalk Loblaws have their Fruits & Veggies) and open that FoodCourt/Hall area to where the Timmie is along with all that dead space at bottom of escalator,... I'm surprised EmpressWalk never had a FoodCourt - I know it's a small mall, but there's a huge high-school at Earl Haig.
The Fairview Mall T&T took 18-months to open because they were converting former Sears Retail Space to Supermarket
- Nov 23, 2021 Announce T&T coming to Fairview Mall - Winter 2022
- May 18, 2023 Store Grand Opening,.... 18 months later!
T&T Supermarket Opens 36,000 sq ft Store at CF Fairview Mall in Toronto, as Part of $80M Sears Box Revitalization [Interview]
CEO Tina Lee discusses the retailer's strategy of opening in malls, and how the deal to open at CF Fairview was years in the making.
retail-insider.com
At EmpressWalk, we have Loblaws Supermarket conversion to T&T,... so comparable is more like Loblaws' 297/301 College (west of Spadina) Independent City Market to T&T:
- Fall 2016 Grand Opening of Independent City Market in Kensington Market
https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/threa...te-core-architects.17619/page-13#post-1163880
- November 18, 2020 - Independent City Market last day - "This Loblaw's Independent CityMarket can't compete against Chinatown grocers, KensingtonMarket nor new FreshCo on Bathurst; last day (tentatively) will be on November 18. Since Loblaw's tied to long term lease here & Loblaw’s T&T lost their “downtown” Cherry St location - rumour is Loblaw's T&T coming here!" posted Oct 26, 2020 by "SunnyRayToronto",... ahem!!!
The College Condominium | 52.73m | 15s | Tribute | Core Architects
Love the colours.
People are lined up around the block for Toronto's new T&T Supermarket
For how much it's constantly changing and evolving, Toronto really does stay the same in some key, distinctive ways — such as the propensity among it…
www.blogto.com
From November 18, 2020 (Independent City Market closing) to August 20, 2021 (T&T opening),.. it took them 9 months to redo a small UrbanFormat store,.. here, they ripped out the 4 year old *relatively new* black wall tiles and red flooring (Independent City Market colours) to install new green wall tiles and white/cream flooring (T&T colours)
At EmpressWalk,... walls and flooring are 25 years old,... it's going take at least 9 months for T&T to open likely a bit more,... depending on kitchen/substations locations, food court, etc,.... so that takes the EmpressWalk T&T well into Summer 2026
Frank Heisler
New Member
I've already seen T&T house-brand products (and even entire shelves) at various Zehrs' outside of the GTA. Visibility has grown in the last year.
If the store is filthy, Loblaws has enough money to hire a third party to shine it all up quickly.
It's entirely possible that they may rebrand just to maintain presence and then renovate in sections.
fatty
New Member
Just announced that this Whole Foods will be closing in a matter of days.
Whole Foods set to close two Toronto stores
American grocery chain Whole Foods is set to shutter two Toronto-based stores in the coming weeks.
www.ctvnews.ca
Frank Heisler
New Member
I'm not surprised. It never seemed to be busy after the initial opening hype.Just announced that this Whole Foods will be closing in a matter of days.
Whole Foods set to close two Toronto stores
American grocery chain Whole Foods is set to shutter two Toronto-based stores in the coming weeks.
Northern Light
Superstar
T&T has been looking for a spot in NYCC for awhile..... it appears one is opening up.....
taal
Senior Member
No they are taking over the Loblaws space ! So loblaws is closing in Empress Walk.
Northern Light
Superstar
Great Tidbit; thanks!