[smallspy]

Below, I'm a bit dubious of very low year 1 (2026) increase. Anytime one defers the pain of paying for improved service......

This may be a function of the lead times required for equipment purchases.

As you correctly point out, there are no increases of 40' buses. But there are large increases of both smaller and larger buses. The lead times required for their deliveries may be such that the system needs to operate in a more-or-less status quo situation until they arrive.

Dan

 

[Northern Light]

This may be a function of the lead times required for equipment purchases.

As you correctly point out, there are no increases of 40' buses. But there are large increases of both smaller and larger buses. The lead times required for their deliveries may be such that the system needs to operate in a more-or-less status quo situation until they arrive.

Dan

Certainly plausible. I don't follow Hamilton all that closely for the most part.

I just have a natural leaning that most systems have surplus vehicles available for off-peak, so you could start increases there. But that's instinct, not evidence as I haven't looked at their fleet and/or fleet deployment situation at all.

 

[smallspy]

Certainly plausible. I don't follow Hamilton all that closely for the most part.

I just have a natural leaning that most systems have surplus vehicles available for off-peak, so you could start increases there. But that's instinct, not evidence as I haven't looked at their fleet and/or fleet deployment situation at all.

You're right, they generally do have a fleet surplus for off-peak times.

But there is also a hesitance for instituting service changes that would require different service patterns and routings for peak versus off-peak times. Considering the scope of the changes, I think that may be at play here.

Dan

 

[gweed123]

You're right, they generally do have a fleet surplus for off-peak times.

But there is also a hesitance for instituting service changes that would require different service patterns and routings for peak versus off-peak times. Considering the scope of the changes, I think that may be at play here.

Dan

The Fall 2025 service improvements were almost exclusively improvements to off-peak service.

New peak service that requires additional fleet isn’t in the cards until the new MSF opens, as the current MTC doesn’t have space for more buses.

 

[nfitz]

This north-south bus plan reminds me of the Ottawa transitway before Ottawa's LRT opened. Buses got stuck in huge queues behind one another. It was often faster to walk, and delays could spiral through the system.

When I commuted in Ottawa over 30 years ago, I used to go from University of Ottawa campus to Kent and Slater. Not once was the bus ever slower than walking; I easily could save 15 minutes on the worst days. But I mostly only took it when it wasn't raining, as it's a nice walk, and I was a starving student. There was never any waiting for a bus, because they were literally everywhere along the street.

When did the buses get slower than walking? I thought there were bus only lanes?

 

[Sauga89]

There were bus only lanes, but the downtown section could get overwhelmed at busy times by the sheer number of buses. At rush hour right before the LRT opened you might see two or three buses waiting for a spot in the Bank bus bay on Slater. Then after the bus stop, the light ahead would be red, and buses which had already collected passengers would block the buses behind. There were bus traffic jams essentially.

Also factor in that the LRT construction closed the dedicated busway on either side of downtown, so the buses could get stuck in car traffic. The right turn at Nicholas off the Mackenzie King Bridge was usually a disaster.

These screenshots from Google streetview in 2019 give a sense of the problem.

Hamilton might not have the same problem, but I count 15 traffic lights on James Street between the escarpment and West Harbour. Then every bus is supposed to turn back and face those same 15 lights heading south. Buses take time to slow down and accelerate, so when you have a line of them and a lot of lights, you really notice. It would help if Hamilton has its lights on James well synced. (EDIT: Fewer buses crowded onto the route than Ottawa would help travel times too. It depends on how many buses James St can handle versus how many are planned.)

 

[innsertnamehere]

Hamilton has "maxed out" it's peak hour service for the last 5 years or so as they don't have any space to store new fleet expansions. In the last 5 years basically every single service enhancement has been in off-peak periods as a result. A lot of the "low hanging fruit" for off-peak expansions has already been picked, so to speak.

The new bus barn in the lower city will give them that capacity to expand peak services early next year, but yes, they need new buses to do that.

The City has consistently funded HSR service expansion for many years at this point, I would be surprised if they don't continue it, especially with the council currently in place. We'll see if/how things change after the 2026 election though.