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if anything they could benefit from relatively easy conversion projects to make something like the NJT multilevel EMUs. they can probably engineer power cars to slot in between the existing coaches without needing to sell of everything. they would only need to get more cab cars to bookend.
this was what the original bilevel concept allowed for but was never further developed. maybe now we have a chance to do so.
NJT’s Multilevel EMUs are new build. They will interoperate with existing MLVs - the two EMU IIIs at TTCI have an existing fleet cab car to complete the test consist - but I don’t believe any conversions are contemplated.

In any case, conversions even where feasible can be tricky - look at how the GO’s Tier 4 conversion project were abandoned after 647.
 
NJT’s Multilevel EMUs are new build. They will interoperate with existing MLVs - the two EMU IIIs at TTCI have an existing fleet cab car to complete the test consist - but I don’t believe any conversions are contemplated.

In any case, conversions even where feasible can be tricky - look at how the GO’s Tier 4 conversion project were abandoned after 647.
The power cars would most definitely be new build. By conversion i meant converting from push pull to MU. It just seems such a no brainer but I'm surprised alstom was never asked to develop this even though they did it for tue MLVs
 
The power cars would most definitely be new build. By conversion i meant converting from push pull to MU. It just seems such a no brainer but I'm surprised alstom was never asked to develop this even though they did it for tue MLVs
You may want to look into the cost and the amount of time that it's taken Bombardier/Alstom to develop these things. Their original announcement came about the same time that VIA announced their contract with Siemens for the Charger/Ventures sets.

Dan
 
You may want to look into the cost and the amount of time that it's taken Bombardier/Alstom to develop these things. Their original announcement came about the same time that VIA announced their contract with Siemens for the Charger/Ventures sets.

Dan
NJT recently announced a board approval for 12 more ALP45A (dual modes) and 200 more MLVs of which only 40 are EMU power cars. This order will replace Comet single levels and can do 110mph where track speed permits.
 
The power cars would most definitely be new build. By conversion i meant converting from push pull to MU. It just seems such a no brainer but I'm surprised alstom was never asked to develop this even though they did it for tue MLVs
The other thing you should bear in mind is while Alstom inherited an MLV EMU project from Bombardier, it didn’t inherit a BL EMU one. Absent a mega order they may prefer to sell Coradia instead.
 
From the Railfanning the Ontario Northland Railway FB group, this post with pictures by Paul Lantz.

1749741318726.png

1749741328973.png
 
For instance a Sunday train may only need four cars in the morning..... but if there is a Jays game in the afternoon it will need it later in the day. Possibly again in the evening for some other event. Cutting cars in and out or swapping consists is labour intensive, and it makes no sense to incur those costs.

Schedules can't be adjusted for faster short trains because they have to be set for the limiting case, which is the 12 car train that may be deployed at times. And given that each route uses a template hourly schedule , it makes no sense to speed up some runs as those would break the pattern.

I have to say, GO is actually running pretty full these days. I rode a midday 6-pack run to Aurora this week that was jam packed. Those longer trains are not that empty so often to create concerns about fuel waste.... it's a nice problem to have.

For this reason I think that as GO moves towards shorter, more frequent trains, they should be increasing their standards for traction vs train length.

Currently based on observations they seem to have the following minimum power guidelines:
6-car: 3000 hp (e.g. 1x F59)
10-car: 4000 hp (e.g. 1x MP40 or 2x F59)
12-car: 5400 hp (e.g. 1x MP54, though they do sometimes run 1x MP40)

To enable scheduled travel times to be reduced, they could increase the minimum power to something like this:
4-car: 3000 hp (e.g. 1x F59)
6-car: 4000 hp (e.g. 1x MP40)
8-car: 5400 hp (e.x. 1x MP54, 2x F59)
10-car: 6000 hp (2x any loco)
12-car: 7000 hp (e.g. 2x MP40)
It would just mean that on those days where you need to run 12-car trains on a 6-car schedule due to a special event, you need to put 2 locomotives on the train, to make sure it can keep up with the schedule.

There could be some exceptions from peak-only commuter express trains, with those trains having a lower power-to-weight ratio and the schedule accounting for that. Acceleration is less critical for those trains since they make fewer stops.
 
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For this reason I think that as GO moves towards shorter, more frequent trains, they should be increasing their standards for traction vs train length.

Currently based on observations they seem to have the following minimum power guidelines:
6-car: 3000 hp (e.g. 1x F59)
10-car: 4000 hp (e.g. 1x MP40 or 2x F59)
12-car: 5400 hp (e.g. 1x MP54, though they do sometimes run 1x MP40)

To enable scheduled travel times to be reduced, they could increase the minimum power to something like this:
4-car: 3000 hp (e.g. 1x F59)
6-car: 4000 hp (e.g. 1x MP40)
8-car: 5400 hp (e.x. 1x MP54, 2x F59)
10-car: 6000 hp (2x any loco)
12-car: 7000 hp (e.g. 2x MP40)
MP54s’ 5400HP includes HEP. I assume the power deliverable to the traction motors is much closer to what the MP40 has available than the figures above suggest.
 

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