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Bojaxs said:
Alstom didn't want to make the Citadis Spirit. They advised against it, but Ottawa City Council wouldn't listen and insisted on a train that was low to the ground while operating as a Metro. Alstom warned them that no such train had ever been built before.

This is probably why Alstom is less than enthusiastic about trying to fix the bogie/ axel issue because they warned Ottawa that this train wouldn't work.

The problem with Line 1/ Confederation line in Ottawa is that it's using the wrong rolling stock. There's no reason why the line shouldn't have the same trains as the REM in Montreal.

en.wikipedia.org

Alstom Metropolis Saint-Laurent - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

en.wikipedia.org

Alstom Metropolis - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
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No one from the TTC or metrolinx have complained about the trains so i think we should drop it as a cause for the slow operation of the line.
 
Obsidian said:
Where have either the TTC or Metrolinx blamed the vehicles for slow operations on Finch??
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I mean, that's part of the problem, isn't it?

They don't want to acknowledge there are issues with the trains.

I'm sure behind closed doors and during private phone calls they discuss all the issues with the trains. They just don't talk about them publicly.

I would imagine most politicians would find it embarrassing to admit they selected the wrong rolling stock/ train for the job. Akin to admitting you bet everything on the wrong horse.
 
Bojaxs said:
I mean, that's part of the problem, isn't it?

They don't want to acknowledge there are issues with the trains.

I'm sure behind closed doors and during private phone calls they discuss all the issues with the trains. They just don't talk about them publicly.

I would imagine most politicians would find it embarrassing to admit they selected the wrong rolling stock/ train for the job. Akin to admitting you bet everything on the wrong horse.
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The TTC would have no problem throwing metrolinx under the bus if it was the vehicles that were having the problem. but they have not said anything bad about the vehicles but they have mentioned about other infrastructure and maintenance problems.

On The Eglinton Line the TTC did mention that they were having problems with the emergency brakes on the Line 5 vehicles for an example. but have never mentioned anything wrong with the line 6 vehicles. With all the finger pointing going on from Metrolinx, the TTC and Mosaic Transit Group, none of them have pointed a finger at the vehicle or the vehicle manufacturer. It would be in all 3 organization interest to blame the vehicle manufacturer after all if the vehicles were giving problems, but they have all blamed problems on other issues.

Since none of them have even hinted about a vehicle defect that leads me to believe they are operating fine.

I would say that the line was rushed into service without enough testing like on line 5 is the main reason for it slow operations.
 
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Obsidian said:
Since none of them have even hinted about a vehicle defect that leads me to believe they are operating fine.
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The Citadis are not operating fine on Finch, i wont get into the details again because they've already been mentioned frequently before.

Steve Munro posted a summary of all the December 2025 issues with the line, and it's clear the Citadis has been plagued with issues:

1771278307013.png
 
Amare said:
The Citadis are not operating fine on Finch, i wont get into the details again because they've already been mentioned frequently before.

Steve Munro posted a summary of all the December 2025 issues with the line, and it's clear the Citadis has been plagued with issues:

View attachment 715727
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Unless you have the data on the other TTC lines how would you know if the vehicles on Line 6 are an outlier.
 
Obsidian said:
Unless you have the data on the other TTC lines how would you know if the vehicles on Line 6 are an outlier.
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The info on the Flexity Freedoms will be exposed in due time (notwithstanding the info that's already known about software issues), while the info on the Flexity Outlooks has been available for many years.
 
lastcommodore said:
Materially, there's not many cases where tram is needed over BRT. I'd reckon the 6FW setup can 2-3x BRT capacity, but frankly I don't know if that capacity is truly needed. but the primary benefits of trams are not in carrying more passengers or speed, it's really more about the soft benefits. Trams appear more "solid" in existence unlike BRT and we can argue about whether that's true or not but that is the conception. Additionally it is more comfortable and more spacious. It may materially be similar but results wise trams bring more passengers and economic benefits over the exact same thing but a bus.

As for penalties... All's in the contract that nobody knows. Transparent as a brick wall.
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What do you consider successful when it comes to a BRT?

Aside from trip times, personally, consider that Mississauga busway a failure.

Same story with all the BRT‘s in York region, though I don’t really have any experience with them in a rush hour!

The only one I know who is successful is Zum but they don’t even have a right of way for most of their routes!

You have the gold plated VIVA system, which you can drive for 20 minutes on any of the routes and not see a bus in that direction!!!
 
turbanplanner said:
What do you consider successful when it comes to a BRT?

Aside from trip times, personally, consider that Mississauga busway a failure.

Same story with all the BRT‘s in York region, though I don’t really have any experience with them in a rush hour!

The only one I know who is successful is Zum but they don’t even have a right of way for most of their routes!

You have the gold plated VIVA system, which you can drive for 20 minutes on any of the routes and not see a bus in that direction!!!
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As for VIVA, when you finally see a bus, it's most likely stuck behind a red light lol
 
robmausser said:
The existing Crosstown vehicles are no longer being made.
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Can everyone stop parroting this?

Alstom is literally producing Flexities for the TTC right now, which are basically an identical vehicle aside from gauge.

Alstom isn't going to gut this model just because it was designed by Bombardier...
 
yurt2022 said:
Can everyone stop parroting this?

Alstom is literally producing Flexities for the TTC right now, which are basically an identical vehicle aside from gauge.

Alstom isn't going to gut this model just because it was designed by Bombardier...
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First off, the last one was completed a couple of months ago.

Second, while they may have been derived from each other they are quite different in the details. The bodies are different, the articulations are different, the motors are different, and the number of motors is different. The input voltage is different. One has more equipment to deal with the signalling systems.

Dan
 
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